PhilGeis
Forum Replies Created
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Liquid. Assume hand dishwash?
eco-friendly is meaningless, you can say that about +/- anything. plant based - you could use plant based SLS Na lauryl sulfate. phosphate free - you’d have a difficult time finding a liquid hand dishwash product with phosphate.
Sulfate free - you can true some glucosides - decy l - amine oxides, etc. or a true soap-based product as Mike mentioned. For true soap, your consumer will have to deal with soap scum - esp. those consumers with hard water.
Automatics are tougher - esp. powders that often use phosphates to address hard water.
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Think the compounds are stable at temp - don’t know that extends to this formula.
One can do what they want for personal use - in any other context, this batch should be scrapped.
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You’ve confused phenylethyl alcohol with phenoxyethyl alcohol. - which are you using? Neither is sufficient and the former is not a good idea in any case
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to the chemistry, I found the primary formula variable controlling free formaldehyde was perfume.
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Sadly - I think the EU limit is 10 ppm so free formaldehyde per se is irrelevant- don’t use FA releasers in that regulatory climate.
FA releasers are also banned in Washington state. https://www.bdlaw.com/publications/washingtons-department-of-ecology-plans-to-ban-formaldehyde-releasers-from-cosmetics/
Ignorance is the only excuse.
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meant the cap and pent glycols
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What is formula, package and product? This would not be esp food in a shampoo.
Generally, Na benzoate is ok - glycols are too low and needs a chelator.
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Please speak in chemical names - not supplier terminology. Phenoxy/EHG with Benzoate and EDTA is reasonable. Why not use CMIT?
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Can you name the product?
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You do need some preservation
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The crappy odor is not something to mask - it indicates a stability issue you need to address
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ecofriendly is subjective nontechnical ad-speak.
of course SLS can be plant based - C12 alkyl from coconut. Soap is more (meaningless) ecofriendly? How so?
synthetic surfactants were successful for one reason - no more soap scum “Saponified oils” = soap.
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This reply was modified 8 months, 2 weeks ago by PhilGeis.
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This reply was modified 8 months, 2 weeks ago by
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Some have reported efficacy with benzoate/benzyl alcohol and with benzoate/sorbic combinations. But as graillotion commented, I do think you’ll find a Gram neg gap that you’ll need to address.
You might tell us pH, packaged and expecgted use.
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Thanks, I see. Suggest you let your challenge testing be guide. In that, don’t settle for the weak standards offered in methods - you should have no recovery of bacteria/candida at day 7 and some effective reduction in mold.
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If this is product of error in making, dump it. Not sure what you’d do with/learn from the stuff.
To the question:
PG, tocopherol and glycerol are not preservatives.
Sorbate and Benzyl alcohol are chemically and PE physically at risk. Magnitude begs pH, package and anticipated use but if an effect, prob only significant in longer term stability.
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Ok - and please, EDTA
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Think a formaldehyde releasers would be a better choice.
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CMI.
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That’s a tough question. It is rinse off but an intimate area. Think I’d not use it in this context.
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benzyl alcohol and benzoate work in formula?
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Phenoxy with a questionable ester. Can you use EDTA? The gluconolactone (breaks down to gluconic acid) is not much.
Need something for fungi - what’s pH?
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What is your policy - FA releasers? parabens? “natural”?
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Would you please add a preservative
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Thanks, I see. Suppose parabens and IT’s are off the list too. oh well.
For leave ons (with lament for FA’s, i knew them well)
9010 with EDTA and benzyl, benzoate or DHA. Control pH. They can add sorbic with benzoic - some think it “synergistic” but I wonder at stability. If they need more efficacy, add glycols (cap or pent or both) at 1% or greater. Dave Steinberg insists antioxidant with benzyl but I don’t think that is a problem.
For surfactants and hair conditioners (with a lament for CMIT, another friend)
9010 with EDTA- and benzyl (for conditioner) and benzoate( for surfactant ) control the pH.
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Germall + but still a FA releaser. 9010 not much for fungi and weak vs Gram +