OldPerry
Forum Replies Created
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Guar would provide some conditioning. It is more frequently used in cleansing formulas but I’ve seen it in conditioners. For coconut oil, I doubt you would notice much difference in the type of coconut oil you use.
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I worked in the Innovation department of R&D at the end of my corporate career. You could look for jobs like this. Most likely you’ll find them at larger companies like Unilever, P&G, L’Oreal, Avon…etc.
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Since no one addressed your preservative question…yes you need one in a cream.
Here are the ingredients they are using.
Phenoxyethanol
Methylisothiazolinone
The EDTA also helps with preservation. -
Do you have to make it fresh every time or can you just add the active ingredient and homogenize?
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When you say “soap” and then say “SLES” that confuses me. SLES is a detergent, not generally what chemists would consider “soap”.
Could you tell us exactly all the ingredients you are trying to combine together?
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It’s unlikely you can clear up the formula after it has become hazy.
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I agree. Neutralize Carbomer. We always used TEA or AMP to do it.
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Yes, you probably need an emulsifier. But it really depends on what specifically is in your formula. You haven’t given enough information to give a good answer.
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Strange. What other ingredients are in the formula? Since GSB is soluble in water there must be some other ingredient that is being kicked out of solution.
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The answer really depends on a few things.
1. What do you consider natural? There is nothing natural about Behentrimonium Methosulfate. And while Geogard Ultra is approved under the Ecocert standards the Sodium Benzoate is strictly produced via synthetic chemistry.
2. What do you want the conditioner to do? How is the hair supposed to feel? What is your benchmark you are trying to meet?
Panthenol won’t do much that would be noticeable to consumers. Hydrolysed oats probably won’t either as they are water soluble and will just rinse away.
Based on the ingredient list you provided this formula won’t have much conditioning.
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I’m curious about quality control for plant extracts.
How do you ensure that the material being supplied to you is actually the plant extract that the supplier says it is?
For standard cosmetic ingredients you can run analytical tests like mass spec or IR to get a signature chemical composition. But for extracts, how do you know you are getting Agascalm extract instead of say Aloe extract? What test would you run?
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A couple thoughts…
I don’t think reducing preservative is a good idea. Why take the risk of contamination? What would be the benefit of doing that? You may be able to, but why do it?
If your preservative is not effective enough a chelating agent can help improve its effectiveness. I don’t think the kind of chelating agent matters, just the amount.
You could buy the separate ingredients and use them as your preservative but using a blend is typically less expensive. It also allows you to keep less chemical inventory which is why most companies work with blends.
In my opinion, you should seriously consider a more traditional preservative package if you’re selling a shampoo in a pH range of 5 - 5.5. That is a prime bacterial growing range.
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I think it is up to the final producer of the product to prove their products are safe.
On the other hand, maybe the stores that sell the products should be responsible for product safety too.
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Basically, there is no good reason not to use a preservative.
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Especially for a product that is supposed to be used around the eye area!
Using a contaminated product could blind someone. -
What Bob said ^^^
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Yes, what do you want the Niacin to do in your hair product?
@David is correct. In a rinse-off product it doesn’t much matter which you choose since none of them are likely to do anything.
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I once worked on a project to make a 3 in 1 shampoo / conditioner / styling product. It didn’t do any of the three things well.
But 2 in 1 shampoo / conditioners can be good. The Pantene formula is a 2 in 1. It still doesn’t work as well as if you used a shampoo and then a conditioner but many people like it.
Incidentally, I use regular shampoo as my body wash too.
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You can’t formulate your product for a single customer. To solve that problem tell your customer not to use your product.
For more detailed answers you’ll need to be more specific and give more information as @Belassi suggests.
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There isn’t any ingredient you can add to a shampoo that will moisturize skin for a long time. And as far as conditioning goes, PQ7 will provide some conditioning. It won’t be as good as something like Dimethicone but that won’t be ask good as having the consumer use a post shampoo conditioner that has cationic surfactants in it. Your question is just not specific enough because terms like “hair so silky and fine” has no scientific definition. I don’t know if your consumer uses the product with PQ7 in it that they will think the hair is silky and fine feeling.
Is there a product on the market that you want to emulate? It would help to start there.
I don’t know if your DEA % is appropriate. That is a level that has been used so it’s not unreasonable. It is a secondary detergent so it shouldn’t weigh down the hair. But this is something you have to test with your consumers because you are asking a question of perception. I have no idea what your consumers will think.
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What do you want the ingredients to do in the formula?
You can put 0% - 5% of glycerin. It just gets washed away anyway so it won’t do much in your formula.
For PQ7, most people use it at a level from 0.1 - 1%. Usually it is at 0.5%
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If they are listing “Omega 6” in their ingredient list then they are not following the labeling rules properly. Omega 6 is a trade name of a blended raw material consisting of Linoleic acid (and) Oleic acid (and) linolenic acid (and) polysorbate 20. That is how it is supposed to be labeled.
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Thanks for the follow-up
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The amount you charge can vary widely. One way you can do it is to figure out how long it will take you to complete the project, double that then decide how much you want to charge per hour.
Or you could just say something like $5000 per formula.
It really depends on how much it is worth to you.
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Google?
What is the name of the brand?