[paoloferino]

Thank you Perry!

[paoloferino]

Can we eliminate the discoloration of the product? Can you help me and send me a procedure how? Thank you

[paoloferino]

I think you need a “carrier” for the essential oils. You need a solubilizer, try PEG-40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil. 

[paoloferino]

Thanks everyone for your responses. You guys are amazing!  

[paoloferino]

I mean the oils. 

[paoloferino]

Sheng said:

I encountered this discoloration when I used Radianskin on our spot correcting cream. It turned to “brownish cream” after few months. Try to do elimination process because when we remove this active on our formulation, it did not discolor.

Thank you, @Sheng. I’ll to eliminate. Does the pH affect microbial activity? Does it make it more rancid? 

[paoloferino]

Radianskin is Hydroxyphenoxy Propionic Acid and EUMULGIN is PPG-1-PEG-9 Lauryl Glycol Ether.

[paoloferino]

Therese said:

Hi, I was wondering if I could get a little feedback on the usage of Blackseed oil, in a facial serum. I have read that people with cancer (Me) breast cancer, should not use Blackseed oil unless they talk to their doctor? Can I ask why? And also what’s the harm. I am not a chemist, just like making homemade products. Thanks in advance Therese

https://www.verywellhealth.com/health-benefits-of-black-seed-oil-89421

This may help you. 

[paoloferino]

UsmanAli said:

is anyone can create an account on ULprospector or BASF to access formulation.
i do many tries but due to too much requirements  i m still failed to create an account please help me 
i m new in cosmetics formulating and i need help from my all senior chemists.
i will be thankful to you

I was given access to ULprospector. I’ve told them that we don’t have a business email but I’ve send a sales invoice with complete details of your company and company address which can be a proof that you are on the personal care industry.

[paoloferino]

lmosca said:

Na4EDTA is the culprit for the high pH. A 1% solution of it in water has a pH of 11+. Also, sodium benzoate will be completely ineffective at that pH, as it is effective (against molds and yeasts) at acidic pH values. You will need a bacteriostatic agent as well. 
Multioil ACE is Soybean oil based, what are the vehicles (solvents) for your other extracts (cucumber, aloe, tomato)? If they are all oil based, then you already have an 8% lipophilic matter in your formula, plus a 4% for the essential oils. 
I second @ngarayeva001, far too much essential oils, at that concentration peppermint oil will be far too irritating (especially for a facial product).

So that answers my question. Thank you Imosca. With this I will again reformulate my product. The cucumber and tomato extract as for assessment I think it is water based extracts only. I’ve used the eumulgin to be the “carrier” of oils. 

[paoloferino]

paoloferino said:

lmosca said:

@paoloferino the point of the aesthetic test is exactly what it says. You have been provided with a subpar product that, even if it might be safe for use (and that is not clear), is visually defective and will never sell, or not as well, even if you manage to bring it out on the shelves. 
Are your product specification clearly outlined in the contractual obligations you have with the supplier?
It goes on to contractual/legal fields from here, and I am not at all prepared to have an informed opinion on this.

I will check again the Memorandum of Agreement with our supplier. We will them within the week for possible solutions and agreements on this matter. Thank you

*meet them

[paoloferino]

lmosca said:

@paoloferino the point of the aesthetic test is exactly what it says. You have been provided with a subpar product that, even if it might be safe for use (and that is not clear), is visually defective and will never sell, or not as well, even if you manage to bring it out on the shelves. 
Are your product specification clearly outlined in the contractual obligations you have with the supplier?
It goes on to contractual/legal fields from here, and I am not at all prepared to have an informed opinion on this.

I will check again the Memorandum of Agreement with our supplier. We will them within the week for possible solutions and agreements on this matter. Thank you

[paoloferino]

ngarayeva001 said:

pH is too high. I know some professional chemists on this forum are not persuaded that low pH products are better but 9? At least bring it down to neutral. Citric acid 50% solution. I am curious what caused that pH.

4% of essential oils! These are irritants. Especially peppermint at such a concentration. Bring it down to 0.3% , 0.5% max.

4% of solubiliser is not sufficient for 4% of oil. It’s usually 4:1 depending on the oil.

Is it Disodium EDTA? You can reduce to 0.2%
I can’t see a preservative. Am I missing anything?

Thank you for your response. Can we use lactic acid instead of citric acid?

For the essential oils, this is noted I will reduce it to your recommended quantity.

I’m using Tetrasodium EDTA and the preservative I’ve used is Sodium Benzoate as a preservative.

[paoloferino]

Just to give you an update on toner. After the mixing, I’ve noticed some things. 

1. Solution is slightly turbid.
2. My pH is 9,2.

Below are the ingredients that I’ve used.

Water - 83.1g
EDTA - 0.4g
Glycerine - 0.5g
Eumulgin L (PPG-1-PEG-9 Lauryl Glycol Ether) - 4g
Cucumber Extract - 2.0g
Aloe Vera Extract - 2.0g
Tomato Extract - 2.0g
Multioil Vit ACE - 2.0g
Peppermint Oil - 2.0g
Lavender oil - 2.0g

My question is, is the pH okoay? If not, what can I use to lower down the pH? Another is, how can I make it a clear solution?

Thank you.

[paoloferino]

ngarayeva001 said:

By the way if your market is more influenced by the Asian rather than European (French) trends, a toner can be slightly thickened as well. Example:

https://www.yesstyle.com/en/earths-recipes-energy-boosting-toner-160ml-160ml/info.html/pid.1069824160

This will also be a great help in my formulation. There are so many ingredients but I know this will be effective. Thank you!  

[paoloferino]

MarkBroussard said:

@paoloferino

You can pretty much use any thickener you want in a Serum … gums, cellulosics, hyaluronic acid, carbomer and other thickening polymers … it’s all a function of the cost & texture profile you want.  “Serums” generally contain a small number of ingredients in high concentrations and are thickened up.  Yes, the are marketed as boosters.

A “Toner” is generally astringent-based, such as Witch Hazel, with other ingredients that “tone” the skin, are water-thin and also contain hydrating ingredients, skin brightening ingredients and the like.

These are marketing terms, but consumers have baked in their minds, the above differences between products marketed as serums and toners.

Thank you Sir @MarkBroussard. This will be a great help.  

[paoloferino]

DAS said:

Also it could be filth, mould, the buggers of a sick employee or a portal to other dimension. The thing is you shouldn’t care. You got a bad batch from your supplier and you are holding the proof. Even if it’s nothing the customers won’t see it that way. As to why, it’s their job to find the answer. If I had a complaint like that I’d refund the client with an apology. That surely was a “send it anyway, perhaps they don’t notice it”.

That’s what I’ve been telling the supplier. But, they are insisting that the soap just went a normal saponification process that formed bubbles during mixing that produced the white spots. I’m still waiting for their final report and response since I’ve asked them to replace 800 pcs of soap with this kind of condition. Thank you.

[paoloferino]

lmosca said:

Very true @Gene, those white spots can be very different things.
I suppose the soap is made cold process, by looking at the texture in the pic.
The spots you see could be as simple as tiny air bubbles incorporated during the mixing of the soap batter. Or, if the soap maker uses a mixture of high-stearic oils and fats (palm, but even more shea butter, cocoa butter, lard, and tallow) those could be “stearic spots”, which are caused by mixing a cold base with not so warm (partially melted) oils and fats. The temperature difference causes stearic and palmitic glycerides to solidify, forming specks that appear in the finished product. 
In both cases the soap is perfectly fine to use, except that it might not pass the aesthetic test. 

A third option would be that those are “lye pockets” where the emulsification of lye water and oils was not complete and uniform, and some lye droplets either were too big or started to coalesce. The soap would be unsafe for use, in this case. 

Thank you for this information. By the way what is the aesthetic test? 

[paoloferino]

Gene said:

It is difficult to “confirm” anything by simply looking at a picture. Most here are kind of hands on people ? when it comes to solving a formula problem. What is your soap maker saying?

Thank you @Gene. They are saying that it’s a normal process of saponification, that white dots are due to bubbles formed. That’s what they are telling us.

[paoloferino]

@MarkBroussard
@ngarayeva001
@Perry
Please help

[paoloferino]

ngarayeva001 said:

Yes, the presence of a thickener in the first one. These all are marketing terms. Same about essences, elixirs, and other fancy terms. 

Thank you for the information. I’ve read this article that serum functions as a “booster”. Meaning it contains more on actives. Your inputs will be noted. But can I use xanthan gum instead of carbomer in serum? 

@JonahRay
I’m from the Philippines. Consumers are looking for a toner or should I say cleansing agent that does not contain any alcohol. My bench mark is attached to this post. 

[paoloferino]

ngarayeva001 said:

No it’s not. Especially untreated one. It will just sink and your product will be transparent with sediment on the bottom, which is not what you want as I understand. Get a pearliser. I posted a link with the one I used and can confirm that it’s effective and easy to use.

Thank you so much! Out sourcing on process. Many thanks, mate!

[paoloferino]

ngarayeva001 said:

I have never seen  “shiny facial wash” but I have a suspicion that you are looking for pearliser:

https://www.ulprospector.com/en/eu/PersonalCare/Detail/1481/52073/TEGO-Pearl-N-300

YES! That’s the term I’ve been looking for. A pearliser! Thank you Sir @ngarayeva001! Can you recommend one? Is Mica feasible?
 

[paoloferino]

MarkBroussard said:

Poly Suga Mulse D9 as solubilizer.  But, my first recommendation would be to not use Jojoba Oil.  Instead, if you really, really want to add an oil, perhaps Rose Hip Oil at 1%.

Thank you!

[paoloferino]

MarkBroussard said:

@paoloferino

Water 83.90
Jojoba oil 3.00
Aloe Vera Extract 3.00
Lime Extract = 1.00
Glycerine = 5.00
Phenoxyethanol = 0.9
Surfactant/Solubilizer

This is going to be a sticky mess with Glycerine loaded in at 5% in a water-based formula.  You might want to cut that down to 1% or less.  Better yet, use Glycerine at 0.5% and Sodium Lactate at 4% to 5% or Saccharide Isomerate at 2% or so.

That’s also a high load of Jojoba Oil that you’ll need to solubilize … you might want to cut that down to 1% and solubilize it with Poly Suga Mulse D9 loaded in at 3% to 5%.  Since Jojoba Oil is actually a wax, it will almost definitely form waxy flakes over time suspended in your base, so Jojoba Oil is not a very good choice for this product format.  

Thank you for this information @MarkBroussard. This will be a good help. I will run this suggestion and I will update. Thank you. Can you suggest any solubilizer though I have an available Polysobrate-20.