Microformulation
Forum Replies Created
-
Silicones and silicone elastomers.
-
If the toothpaste is packaged in a traditional manner it will also get some protection from the packaging. I often see some DIY adjacent lines place it in a “jar” or a “pot” and lose this protection.I understand and appreciate self-preservation when done properly. If someone follows the “hurdle technique” and takes other measures, it is certainly possible. Any credible Formulator would follow-up with testing. It takes a highly credible and technical approach. The problems arise when someone inexperienced and unaware of the care it requires simply reads a few sources, adds an ingredient or two and then assumes the product is preserved. There is no follow-on testing and it arises from the overconfidence that we see in so many beginners. In these cases, marketing is king (“people don’t like preservatives”) and the Science is faulty. It may sound as if I am picking on a certain market sector, but I am retained to “fix” one of these gross errors at least 3 times a quarter.
-
We have fixed the problem in Commercial applications by simply increasing the glycols.
-
ULProspector has tightened up its credentialing significantly. I will occasionally get calls from them asking me if I know of such and such company in my region. They had issues about 24-36 months ago where some uncredentialed accounts were added and they abused the sampling process.Even with a ULProspector account, certain companies will require you to request access to their files as a separate process. Inolex comes to mind as one such example.
-
Also, the L-ascorbic acid will not be stable in such an aqueous medium. I would research this topic as there are numerous previous posts regarding its instability. You will see browning of the solution fairly quickly.
-
Have you had issues with the Mustard oil at 10% as well? That is also irritating and any evidence that it stimulates hair growth is anecdotal and as such unproven.
-
You might want to post your Formula as there are factors which could be causing this unrelated to fill temperatures.
-
When I graduated in 1987, BSPharm was the standard and the PharmD was a graduate degree. At that time anyone getting a PharmD usually went into Institutional Pharmacy. The PharmD became a requirement at a later point. Many of my classmates still practice in NYS with a BS Pharm as they are grandfathered in. I imagine that this group will slowly retire out.Some of my answers may come across as unhelpful, but it is really because I believe that educating oneself through a study of credible resources is more effective and in fact will deliver information that would be missed through a simple targeted answer.For example, to the original point. The preservative based on organic acids needs a lower pH would be the simple targeted answer. A more wide-ranging reading by the OP would bring up the class itself, the use of chelants, glycols and generally perhaps a detailed explanation of the Hurdle Technique. Had the answer simply been “drop the pH” the OP may have fixed the problem at hand, but would be “robbed” of additional useful information that would serve her better in the long run. In my opinion, there is value in pointing them in the proper direction, but also challenging them to develop Professionally.
-
There is also a lot of overconfidence in many Home Crafters. I bill out at least 12 hours a week fixing issues for these lines.
-
It does lead to faster dissolution. It was standard practice in several manufacturers I worked at.Regardless, having been trained in both Compounding Pharmacy and Formulation (different evolutions), a Mortar and Pestle is hardly the best tool.
-
Generally, I use mine to triturate powders and reduce the particle size to facilitate the dissolution process. For example, salt when doing a salt curve.Any other use can be done with any one of my IKA Overhead mixers more efficiently. With these appropriate equipment, the Mortar and Pestle become obsolete. I doubt that you would really exert enough shear to properly disperse ZnO for a sunscreen with this equipment.Honestly, Compounding Pharmacy is where it would come into use. Formulating is far different.
-
I still have my Mortar and Pestle from Pharmacy school. However, I rarely use it in Formulations.
-
I would drop the TTO down from 2%. It presents several issues at that level.
-
There are advantages to both approaches. For example, oftentimes a Contract Manufacturer will deeply discount the Formulation fee and make-up their costs in manufacturing. Also, in many cases, you can have a more streamlined process by working with the Contract Manufacturer.The biggest myth is that the success of a line relies entirely upon the Formula. There is not a Formula that could be safe from being knocked off. Your real success will come from Marketing and Smart Business Decisions. This reliance on best business practices is a key reason why lines should not in most cases manufacture and sell their own products. You will not excel in any area since you will be spread far too thin. Rather than excelling in any area, you will scrape by in many.
-
1. We charge a very similar fee to what was quoted by EVchem. Not to be vague, but generally, fees are internal information.2. Contracts are crucial for the best interests of both the Formulator and the client. We did not find a standard form but rather created a Work-For-Hire agreement that was approved by an Attorney. It is significantly different for a full Formulation. It helps the client to see what they paid for and it protects the Formulator from unexpected demands (“I thought the Sunscreen Testing was part of the standard fee?”)3. We do not own the Formulation. Firstly, this is an advantage of working with a Consultant. The client wons the Formulation and gets more access to the R&D process. It also requires that the Master Record for their Formula is complete and the Formulation is validated. Lacking this due diligence will interfere with the client’s ability to retain a Contract Manufacturer.4. We also do 3 revisions. We do have some wiggle room, but it does help, especially with a client that will foolishly keep attempting to rewrite the Product Development once we are in the Lab. That happens quite a bit despite our urgings that the PD should be considered “written in stone” once we go to the next step. we average less than 2 revisions. This is a result of well-defined Product Development briefs. In our experience, many revisions are errors of omission in the Product Brief and rarely an error of commission.
-
THAT is a danger sign also. Keep in mind that many Formulators will NOT sign an NDA at all. We do. We have a sample NDA which we provide to our less sophisticated clients. If they submit a prepared NDA, I have it reviewed. True story, I was once contracted to do two Formulations. The client sent me an NDA with a noncompete clause that would have banned me from Formulating for 5 years. That isn’t my opinion. tt was the feedback our Attorney gave us. I refused to sign that NDA.And when Carol took that deposit, she should have logged off and gotten busy. No offense, but I don’t see a great deal of sophistication in your Formulation.
-
Well, I guess my best advice is to avoid a Formulator who “teaches” these subjects as a Primary Contractor. While there are some outstanding educators out there (Perry, Jane Barber, Susan Barclay), there also some whose primary qualification to “teach” is a camera, an Internet connection, and a dangerously sparse knowledge base. For example, I have had some people come to me with Elementary questions that show they have a gap in their knowledge and need to grow quite a bit. Three months later I have seen them teaching classes.I think as Perry pointed out if they are on Twitter, Instagram, etc. that could reflect an imbalance in their priorities and would be a reason to pass. As you can attest, there was probably a point where you wished “Carol” taught less and networked less online and simply got into the Lab and did what you paid her to do.
-
No offense, but it would be good to hear Carol’s side as well. In some cases, it comes down to a contract issue such as they have completed the work. For example, in many contracts, the work product ends upon approval of the Formulation. It is for this reason that many insist upon detailed work-for-hire contracts. Did you approve the initial Formulation?Let me relay an experience. We did a Sunscreen. It met all the testing requirements and the Formulation was approved. For a very silly reason, the client returned and insisted upon a full reformulation, not due to performance, but marketing. (They cited an Etsy seller who touted that her unregistered homemade sunscreen was “silica free” and now hers had to be silica free.) We are a Business and I simply refused to return all the way to the first step of redoing the Product Development, Formulations, and Testing. She then insisted that since “we used the silica” we should pay to repeat the testing. There is not a Formulator on this board that would likely have taken the hit as it was silly and not reflected anywhere in the paperwork they submitted. She cajoled and threatened. We disengaged.In that case, I am sure they stated their side of the story that I was a “Carol.”Every Professional Formulator, if they have done credible work, has had a client like this.Not disbelieving any story, but as someone who adheres to the Scientific method, I need more data. Just making a fair counterpoint.
-
Do you have a Technical Background in Cosmetic Manufacturing? If not, it is a risk. There is another thread here that outlines the dangers (financial) if you do not.
-
Perfect. That was really what I was hinting at. These properties can’t be extrapolated by reading a few blogs, but rather with simple experimentation in the lab.
-
MarkBroussard said:When a potential client tells me they are intending to “self-manufacture” the products I develop for them as opposed to working through a contract manufacturer, I immediately turn down the business.
I agree 100%.
-
Sure, what address should I send the invoice to?
-
Not to be defeatist, but you likely will have to write-off any loss to life experience.