[Jasmine2]

Love it! I’m still getting used to it though so it’s a bit difficult to navigate the forum on the whole. But besides that, I prefer this new format a lot more.

[Jasmine2]

I use allantoin. Been using it everytime I make products with AHA. No recrystallization issues and no instability whatsover. I use mine at 0.5%. 

[Jasmine2]

Paprik said:

I don’t think you need to slurry the HEC. Just add to water, disperse properly, raise pH, let hydrate and do whatever you need after  

Yes. I’ve figured there are different ways of working with HEC. Just wanted to see if creating a slurry in glycerin will reduce the soapy effect HEC gives on application to skin. 

[Jasmine2]

ariepfadli said:

Add some volatile solvent like alcohol or PG will help to break foam formed during rubbing on your skin, i also have that problem, but as serum usage not as much you apply in you hand, so it’s okay as long you rub it more slower with slight pressure the foam will disappears. If still persistent reduce viscosity or hec concentration.

Thanks so much. I finally reduced the % of HEC to 0.35%. It still foams but not as much. I hydrated the HEC in glycerin first before adding water. Next time, I’ll retry it with PG. 

[Jasmine2]

Vignesh_95 said:

Lilly said:

So, I decided to formulate a test batch of AHA serum using HEC as the gelling ingredient. I honestly don’t know what grade of HEC I purchased as I got it from a local supplier who has no idea what grade of HEC she’s selling. But my main concern is on the soapy effect it gives on application to the skin. While it creates a clear serum-ey gel at the right percentage and also sinks in beautifully into the skin, I hate the soapy effect it offers. Is this normal with HEC? If so, how can it be avoided without changing the formula to an emulsion serum

Hi, You can Try with Xanthan Gum(Keltrol Range), and Polyquaternium 37 Which give a clear transparent Gel System. Ultrez Range Polymers also Can Be Used

Thanks so much. I’ll reformulate these when I have my hands on any of these. 

[Jasmine2]

ketchito said:

@Lilly HEC can have that effect. Could you replace some of your HEC with Xanthan gum?

Thanks for your reply. I would’ve done so but the grade of xanthum gum I have at the moment is quite low. Very stringy and creates cloudy gels. But when I have my hands on xanthum gum soft, I’ll try it again. 

[Jasmine2]

Lilly said:

So, I decided to formulate a test batch of AHA serum using HEC as the gelling ingredient. I honestly don’t know what grade of HEC I purchased as I got it from a local supplier who has no idea what grade of HEC she’s selling. But my main concern is on the soapy effect it gives on application to the skin. While it creates a clear serum-ey gel at the right percentage and also sinks in beautifully into the skin, I hate the soapy effect it offers. Is this normal with HEC? If so, how can it be avoided without changing the formula to an emulsion serum

Microformulation said:

You would really need to post the entire Formulation for anyone to helGraillotion said:

Are you saying….what is on your hand….is Just HEC and water?

No. That is not what I’m saying. However, prior to taking this picture, I made dissolved 0.5% HEC in 99.5% water. I experienced thesame but did not take it seriously since it was my first time working with HEC. I’ll make another batch with just HEC and distilled water and send a picture over of the soapy feel

[Jasmine2]

Microformulation said:

You would really need to post the entire Formulation for anyone to help.

Distilled water       25%. 

allantoin.                0.5%    

sodium lactate.     3%.      

hyaluronic acid.     0.1%.    

citric acid                1%.       

lactic acid.               7.95%.  

glycolic acid.           2.27%.   

distilled water.        58.08%.    

HEC.                          0.6%.          

germall plus.            0.5%.          

NaOH solution.         q.s

[Jasmine2]

MarkBroussard said:

@Lilly:

If all you’re doing is adding Chamomile Extract so you can list it on the label, then just add one drop of extract to your formula.  Your list of ingredients is just fine for an AHA serum.  If you’re looking for a way to differentiate it, perhaps take a look at addng a polyhydroxy acid instead of plant extracts.

Alright. Thanks so much. Sincerely appreciated

[Jasmine2]

MarkBroussard said:

@lilly:

The better question is:  Will Chamomile Extract (or any plant extract, for that matter) do anything in the formula at all at any pH?  The typical commercial extract is at most 8% extract + 92% water, glycerin or butylene glycol.  Add 1% of that to a formula and you have 0.08% extract.  And, 0.8% is generous … many extracts are only 1% - 2% extract.  They are label ingredients. 

Thanks so much for your reply. Yes, I’m aware they may have little to no effect in the formula. The main reason I intend adding them is for label appeal. But then again, I just wanted to be sure I wasn’t going to compromise the stability of the final product with the addition of a botanical extract

[Jasmine2]

Pharma said:

What kind of question is this exactly?

If it’s a marketing Q: Yes, sure, it will always work.

If it’s a chemical Q: Depends on the extract and its composition. Generally, plant extracts are more likely to be stable at lower pH. However, there are also constituents which are most stable at +/- neutral pH and others which are always unstable (such as chamazulene).

If it’s a spiritual/esoteric Q: Theoretically yes, ‘activity’ in this field usually doesn’t care about natural laws of physics and chemistry etc.

And finally a pharmacological Q: Most likely, that extract of yours is so highly diluted already that, once incorporated into any type of formulation, it simply never works.

Thanks

[Jasmine2]

PhilGeis said:

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C10&q=african+black+soap&btnG=

Thanks so much

[Jasmine2]

Thank you. Was wondering if it wouldn’t affect the final viscosity of the scrub though as I still want it pourable. I’m specifically talking about increasing the % of the low HLB emulsifier present.

Secondly, can I pair lotionpro 165 with sorbitan stearate for this? Considering the fact that lotion pro 165 gives a light weight emulsion even at a higher %?

[Jasmine2]

And in my very first KISS batch, I started out with 0.3% xanthum gum, the final viscosity was a thick and extremely slimy scrub. I could not even spread it. It felt like sugar coated in some sort of slime..

[Jasmine2]

Hi. It’s regular xanthum gum. 0.02% is enough to create a gel creamy scrub with as little as 10% water in my formula. In lotions, I make use of it at 0.3% and it isn’t gel like due to the high % of water I have in the formula. I believe this is why I have a creamy gel like scrub.

And I tried lots of KISS batches before arriving at this formula. It was simply water, glycerin, polysorbate, emulsifiers, and preservative. I had pretty stable scrub for up to three weeks (didn’t watch it after three weeks though. I just used it) before scaling up to formulate a 250g of scrub with the complete ingredient yet this keeps happening

[Jasmine2]

Hi. The aim is to achieve a pourable scrub texture that’s easy to spread and glide smoothly on skin. It’s quite impossible to achieve that with an all oil soluble scrub with waxes and thickeners.

Water is there to create an emulsion. Glycerin is there as a cheap humectant which will also help in creating a slurry with the xanthum gum. I also did not want the scrub to feel oily like oil based scrubs. I’ve been able to achieve all of this and I love the texture and feel. My main issue is on its stability.

Between, I’ve formulated an anhydrous scrub. Feels quite lovely on skin. But I wanted to try something different atleast.

Picture 1 is the pourable scrub. Picture 2 is my anhydrous scrub which I’ve got no issues with. But the textures, they vary really greatly.