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The first question would be if you’re formulating this product for a client of for yourself. If it’s for the latter, then it’s best to get the info from scientiffic sources (EWG and Sephora are far from being scientiffic let alone unbiased). For instance, if you want info about 1,4-dioxane, check the comment from the FDA website (https://www.fda.gov/cosmetics/potential-contaminants-cosmetics/14-dioxane-cosmetics-manufacturing-byproduct#Is) or the document from the SCCP of the EU under the title <font color=”rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)” face=”inherit”>Considerations on Acceptable Trace Level of 1,4-Dioxane in Cosmetic. That’s a very small molecule that eavporates quickly when on skin so no signifficant penetration occurs. Also, it’s not a </font>significant<font color=”rgba(0, 0, 0, 0)” face=”inherit”> contaminant to water when rinsed, where there are other industries that contribute way more tobthe release of that chemical. For your formula, most of the ingredients are actually synthetic (which doesn’t mean that’s but, but they are for sure not natural). Now, using natural oils can actually promote the overpopulation of some microbes from your skin (the lipophilic ones) that loooove fat more than I do, hehe, with the risk of skin inflammation due to metabolites (check the asociación of dandruff severidad due to the release of oleic acid). </font>

fda.gov

1,4-Dioxane in Cosmetics

FDA infrormation on 1,4-dioxane, a contaminant that may occur in trace amounts in certain cosmetics.amounts in certain cosmetics.

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If what settles is very little in amount and it’s not solid, then it might be your paprika extract.

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Do you have an oven to do a knock out test? My main suspects are shea butter (refining can varied between batches) unless you’re absolutely sure you used the same batch, your fragrance (to which I’d add some Tinogard TL in case that was the issue) and your preservative (piroctone olamine could react with some metal traces).

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Also check if you used the same batch of shea butter (refining differences could aso lead to different hues).

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My first question is what’s MPG. Also, it’d be good to check if you used the same batch for these ingredients:

- fragrance (oxidation?)

- sensicare c1060 (it has piroctone olamine and it can switch color)

Try also to increase the chelant and add a radical scavenger like Tinogard TL which you could add as a premix with the fragrance.

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Thank you @PhilGeis and @graillotion for your comments!

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If those are percentages of each raw material (not total active of each), then you’re using too little surfactant content. Also, switch from HEC to HPMC. I’d also rethink the preservative system you’re using, replace Lamesoft by a water soluble cationic polymer like PQ-10.

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PQ-10 and Lamesoft work and feel differently. The first works more as a softening agent and the latter, an emollient (lubricant). If I had to choose between them, I’d choose PQ-10 since it deposits more at lower concentrations, and its effect is more percievable.

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@PhilGeis Just wonder what your opinion is on this new boosted Na benzoate that “works” at pH as high as 8.5. This new preservative has Na benzoate, EDTA and polyamine. I don’t see how this mix can do the magic, but maybe it’s just my brain limitations…or maybe it’s one of the many fairy tales from suppliers.

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I think a C20 (arachidyl) has an issue not only of abundance, but that it’s between what’s commonly used for structuring agents (C16-18) and what’s used for conditioning (C22). Of course there are exceptions (CTAC, SAPDMA), but a C22 gives the cationic surfactant better conditioning. Interestingly, that Montanov supports the idea that for good packing, you need both your structuring agent and your emulsifier to have the same alkyl chain lenght.

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When did you add both HEC and your carbomer, and for how long did you mix them? They usually go at the very start and require quite some time and mixing to fully hydrate. Also, is that a cleanser? Why do you use SLS (there are better emulsifiers and sodium free, which carbomers usually don’t tolerate).

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Welcome to the club, hehe. The issue is of course their calculators (I once tried several combinations of UV filters, and there was a different in SPF from both tools that went up to 30 points, which is weird since they both should use the same entry info (extinction coefficients, etc.).

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Do you also add sodium chloride? You could try one sample without PQ-7 and adding Guar HPTC at the start (before the surfactants).

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@Gulfam What you should keep in mind first is that even if you add Na4EDTA to a neutral pH solution and then reduce the pH up to around 4, you’ll have the same molecule as if you used Na2EDTA instead (ionization state is dependent on the solution’s pH).

Now, what Belinda might have meant is that Na4EDTA has more binding capacity (more ionized carboxylic groups which are its binding sites) and/or that Na4EDTA forms more soluble complexes than Na2EDTA.

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IFRA always puzzled me, since their evaluations seem to be more loose. Let me put an example: cinnamic aldehyde according to IFRA for the category 9 (shampoos and soaps), can be present up to 0.49% in the finished product (quite high frankly for a known allergen). On the other hand, for Cosing (or the EU), the same allergen should be declared at concentrations above 0.01% for the same category of products. While the EU doesn’t ban the allergen, that you have to label it above 0.01% make fragrance companies to at least use that ingredient with some caution (theoreticaly, under IFRA you could have a shampoo fragrance purely made with the allergen and comply with their regulation). That also reminded me why IFRA opposed to the release of the 82 allergen new list from the EU, back in the day.

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That type of opacifiers don’t like salt that much, so try to reduce it. Also, if there’s a cationic material in your formula, that could also impair its stability.

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Fragrance level and natural oils are a red flag, especially if it’s an after shave. People for sensitive skin can show reacciona to fragrance allergens and free fatty acids (especially high levels of oleic acid). Having an antioxidant is needed, but as @abdullah suggested, that level is way too much. Also, if that Aloe Vera extract is a water or PPG based one, concentration is usually low; more over, if you solubilize it, much of it won’t be available to interact with your skin. You could use some bisabolool instead.

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I only used a couple of tools for formulation: Mini tab, and GPTs.

With the former, I heard from different disciplines that younger professionals rely more and more on this tool and neglect formal training and knowledge, which I find more like a disadvantage since that tool needs to be feed, and its results interpretation will lack the perspective that knowledge and practical experience provides.

With GPTs, I find that you need to e really precise, to the point that you really need to know your stuff for it to be useful (else, it’ll lie right to your face). Also, when reviewing evidence, GPTs might often miss critical papers/reports.

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I’m aware Mini tab is not an AI tool….it’s just my monthly rage against it 🤓

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Glycerin can be sticky when you use more than some level, like 4-5%. But I understand now. Yes, you could use a mixture of humectants (unfortunately, not the occlusive ones since they are not water soluble). For a water based serum, perhaps Glycerin, PPG (or Urea) and Hyaluronic acid could work well.

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Tetrasodium glutamate diacetate has 4 possible groups available for chelation (they are carboxylic groups). The idea is that you go as high on pH to have them deprotonated. The best performance is actually at a pH over 9, but that’s not a normal pH of a cosmetic (same cas if you want to at least have 3 deprotonated groups, which require a pH above 6). Now, at a pH of above 4.5-5.0, you at least have two deprotonated groups, which is ok (not great, but ok). Citric acid can work as a weak chelant, and it happens that at a pH above 5.0, it also has 2 groups deprotonated. That’s why it can help bosst Tetrasodium glutamate diacetate. Unfortunately, lactic acid is not as useful since it only has one carboxylic group.

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I advise not to buy into supplier’s fairy tales. If that 30h test was done independently and compared to glycerin, then glycerin might have kicked acetamidoethoxyethanol’s ass. Considering both as hygroscopic materials, glycerin has the ability to bind more water molecules and more tightly. It has other properties as well when entering skin, and the best part, it’s super cheap.

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@PhilGeis You’re right, and I was very surprised to find the huge lack of human testing, and the overwhelming amount of in vitro data.

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There’s this interesting review:https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10690560/

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Mouthwash Effects on the Oral Microbiome: Are They Good, Bad, or Balanced? - PMC

This narrative review describes the oral microbiome, and its role in oral health and disease, before considering the impact of commonly used over-the-counter (OTC) mouthwashes on oral bacteria, viruses, bacteriophages, and fungi that make up these ...

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You could use both citric and lactic acid (many formulas for hair do, just check on the new Elseve formulas, especially the ones for shine and damaged hair…there’s a very nice strenghtening effect from the use of organic acids based on scientiffic evidence).