Doreen
Forum Replies Created
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@KingRoland78
I don’t know if polysorbates help retain the lifespan of a fragrance. I’ve used them as solubilizer mostly.
When I’ve solubilized a fragrance with (in my case) polysorbate 80 (I don’t know if 20 is better than 80 for this or vice versa), I mixed the polysorbate 80 with the fragrance (after warming the polysorbate a little bit until it becomes liquid) and incorporate it in the rest of the formula while mixing. -
You’re welcome.
I don’t see any mentioning of safflower oil?
There are three types of sunflower oil, the difference between these lies in the fatty acid profile. High in linoleic acid (the one you’ll find in the grocery store), high in oleic acid and medium oleic. These (poly)unsaturated fatty acids oxidize quickly. This is the reason why I never use sunflower oil in my stuff. (Same goes for safflower oil by the way, about the same levels of linoleic- (70-80%) and oleic acid (15-20%).)
Jojoba oil for example is one of the most stable oils (actually it’s a wax, not an oil). If I use veggie oils, it’s mostly jojoba.I forgot about your question about the chelators in my previous post. Dinatrium EDTA for example is a strong chelator. There’s also tetrasodium EDTA, which is usually used in formulations with higher pH’s. In cold process formulations I mostly use sodium phytate (Dermofeel PA-3 by Evonik).
About the carbomers, most of these are sensitive to electrolytes, so you’ll may want to change some ingredients, like sodium lactate and citrate. Most carbomers need to be neutralized (with TEA or NaOH) and need a pH of about 6 (some are already neutralized). There’s a whole range of other synthetic polymers that can be used for stability, thickening and skinfeel, some of these also have emulsifying properties. (If you would use one of those as sole emulsifier you can make a 0% emulsifier claim on your product.) Some also have a higher electrolyte tolerance, like Sepimax Zen (polyacrylate crosspolymer-6).
Benzyl alcohol + DHA, like in Geogard 221 smells awful by the way! I found it very hard to mask. But of course it’s personal, some people don’t mind the smell as much.
Good luck experimenting and keep us updated!
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@Hina_Alam
I found this document on the site of Lotioncrafter, hope it’s helpful for you.
(Under the section ‘SDS & Tech data’, the document I added is the ‘technical bulletin’). -
@Gunther
I thought that distilled water could also absorb gases like CO2 from the air, that this is the reason why the pH is usually lower over time? Or am I mistaken? -
Why don’t you donate a million? At least!
I’m sorry, but I don’t think it’s any business of yours what amount of money members will donate. Nice action by making people feel bad that they can’t give at least a hundred like you did.
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I’ve read through some documents of preservative blends of several manufacturers, but unfortunately I can’t find information about the way it’s derived.
Maybe it’s an idea to pick some manufacturers and ask them if they have preservatives that meet your demands?
Phenonip (Clariant) and Germall or Germaben II (Ashland) for example are good broad spectrum preservative blends. I’ll add some documents, perhaps they may be of help.I see you have sorbic acid in your formula. What is the pH?
FYI sorbates can cause flushing reactions (red, warm skin) for some people (I’m one of them).Maybe it’s also an idea to add an anti-oxidant, like tocopherol or BHT. Sunflower oil isn’t very stable and prone to oxidize.
Instead of xanthan gum you could try a carbomer. It’s my experience that carbomers (and other synthetic polymers) give a much better skinfeel than gums.
1% fragrance, synthetic or essential oil is quite a lot by the way.
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Does the preservative system have to be natural compliant?
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And from a pharmaceutical point of view emulsions were and are needed as a vehicle to disperse substances for skin treatment.
It’s amazing how many benefits and properties people in skincare blogs attribute to vegetable oils, but apart from being emollients, they don’t do much else.
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Where I work, the non-sterile (pharmaceutical) skincare packaging isn’t treated at all. We use it straight from the boxes. According to GMP we only need to perform a visual inspection. The boxes are stored in a class D (I believe that’s ISO class
cleanroom environment. -
@em88
Thanks! :+1: -
You’re welcome! :+1:
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The melting point is 66-70C (see added brochure), so heating might indeed be a good idea.
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Good luck and keep us updated!
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Hibiscus is quite acidic and can lower the pH significantly. (I didn’t use it in hair products however)
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@majoiem
I see you use borage oil in your body oil, this oil oxidizes really fast, due to the high content of (poly)unsaturated fatty acids. A tip for you might be to add an anti-oxidant like tocopherol or BHT at 0,05 - 0,1%. Is it deodorized oil by the way? The smell of pure borage to me is nauseating and very hard to mask with a fragrance, even in low concentrations.@”Dr Catherine Pratt”
I had a similar problem with fragrance in an oil blend. Thanks for clearing it up! :+1: -
You’re welcome!
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@KingRoland78
I don’t see any fragrance in your formula? Or do you mean the menthol scent that comes from the menthol crystals?@em88
I’ve seen O/W formulas where the polysorbate is added to the oil phase. Does it depend on the type to which phase it should be added?
Is polysorbate 80 also suitable for stabilizing fragrances? -
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62,5% of 96% ethanol? Then extra preservatives shouldn’t be necessary. I have no idea what your whole formula is, so I can’t really say something about the importance of adding both BHA and BHT.
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You’re welcome :kissing_heart:
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@ngarayeva001
If the formula allows, I always disperse polymers in the oily phase, which is in my case usually a combination of (more or less) polar esters, vegetable and sometimes mineral oils. So far I fortunately haven’t had any problems (unless the interaction can go unnoticed and cause problems much later on).
Tego carbomer 141 is heat sensitive (>60C), so it needs to be added after emulsification in an oil dispersion, which is usually done with only one type of oil. Now I know I’d better not choose something like CCT for this! -
Ok, I hope you will find a solution soon. Good luck!
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You mean chloride, right? If you do mean chlorine-free, you can use tap water I think?
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I use deionized water.
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You need a gelformer that can withstand electrolytes due to the K alum and most carbomers can’t. So xanthan gum might indeed be an alternative.
Why would you want camphor in your deodorant?