Cst4Ms4Tmps4
Forum Replies Created
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I think I understand what you meant.Is it in a wide mouth jar? What sort of container is it contained?How much of it is in the container? This matters because if container too big or product too little (almost finishing), the top layer tends to form a skin that will not stick to finger, and will stick if you scoop it out because you are exposing the inside.We do not know how much of those stated chemicals are in your formulation to provide you with precise data. Is it partially national secret? LMAO! Chemists may want to know as much as possible in order to help you rather than guessing like this. Write an assay if you can. Erm…I mean essay. :pSometimes the chemists also want to know what fragrance and colouring substances you use, if you do use them. -
Ah ha! I thought I am the only one not getting notifications! I have to keep tabs open and keep checking for answers. This is certainly inefficient!Maybe notification works only if people tag names. This is bad if it is true because we, the non-experts, miss lots of good stuff. And those who answer may think that we are not serious hit(ask)-and-run.
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Instead of laying the blame on Xanthan Gum or other thickeners, first blame Salicylic Acid.Salicylic Acid is notorious for its recrystallisation in water. It is a very difficult chemical to work with.I am not sure whether SLES can solubilise SA properly or not. I have no experience in making SA wash/shampoo.Is heat applied?Get this resolved first before worrying about thickeners.
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Weird. At pH 5 Salicylic Acid should be fine.Since I ‘wasted’ lots of materials in my tests, I can ‘save’ you some money.
There are two surest way to dissolve or solubilise Salicylic Acid.1) Lots of Propylene Glycol and some nonionic surfactant (I use PEG-40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil. Polysorbate 80 also works). I do not think this can be added to anything as it may recrystallise. I don’t know for sure as I do not mix it with anything else.2) After I got fed up using crazy much Propylene Glycol as in point (1), I followed what @MarkBroussard mentioned in this site with a twist. Instead of using Sodium Citrate, I add Sodium Bicarbonate. This actually neutralises some Salicylic Acid forming Sodium Salicylate. Make it pH 3 to pH 4. Oh my, this works wonderfully! You can actually judge it by its turbidity (no need keep checking pH like a fool).But the trick is you really need to make Salicylic Acid crystals extremely small to work well. Meaning, dissolve it in Propylene Glycol and nonionic surfactant, with heat. I do not think this is called solvation as it is not a salt. More like a suspension. Identical to oil in water is not truly dissolved in water in the presence of surfactant, the oil is still there and exist in tiny droplets which are being suspended in water.Next, is to add some water to the SA-PG-nonionic sufactant solution and then neutralise it. Look at the colour change. Ah, chemistry is fun! My friends always say that I make things look like semen (white but not very white, and slimy). I do not work with so-called “high-tech” stuff promoted by marketing. I make functional stuff, not beautiful stuff.You could try making it without Propylene Glycol or nonionic surfactant or neutralisation. I have no luck with either one if they are singled out, or either one is taken out.If Polysorbate 80 is used I think you can see Salicylic Acid in the form of oil droplets in water! Amazing! I prefer using PEG-40 HCO because I do not need to use it as much as Polysorbate 80. Maybe many extra two lipophilic tails in PEG-40 HCO compared to Polysorbate 80.Oh one more thing is I increase the suspension power by adding Xanthan Gum. This is my ‘perfect’ SA solution! It definition is not as potent as very acidic one but it does really work and I can feel my skin is dry. Excellent for my greasy and acneic skin. Really Sciencesend. Not madly irritating compared to very acidic one. -
Yes. It is difficult to get help without knowing what is in your national secret if it is formula specific.
But I think this topic could be answered, easily, without knowing what is in there.
Generally, oily stuff are not sticky and can mitigate tackiness. Not necessary oil as in things named with ‘oil’. Can be solid substances such as Cetyl Alcohol, some butters, some esters, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, stuff with benzene ring.
Generally, it is the watery stuff that are sticky due to hydrogen bonding. They stop being sticky when they are at a certain (high) concentration. Glycerol/Glycerin is famous for being tacky, but it is not tacky if it is used at, say 40% or 60%, it will become “oily” and stays oily for quite some time even after water evaporates.
I do not know what UCON-75-H-450 and PEG/PGG 17-6-Copolymer are. But I know that some humectants, emollients, surfactants, solvents, oils, so on and so forth which are said to provide slip, slide, and glide, or not sticky/tacky may not be what they are said to be.
Ultimately, what is in your formula may be very important. Because you may have too much tacky stuff, or some chemical reactions among those stuff that make the final product tacky. It also could be the brand or purity or both, of the same substance you use. Example, lately, I realised that common/cheap Xanthan Gum is sticky and stringy, but expensive Xanthan Gum by Jungbunzlauer is not stick nor stringy. Same name but different qualities.
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This is an old discussion I know and I do not know whether I have something valueble to add or not. More like question/s. Depending on the individuals - Some people think that my questions give them ah ha moment. Some people think that I am stupid.
I must say the same as what @Doreen mentioned “Very relevant to me”. LOL! Because it is!
You see, I am going back to one of my first/oldest formulation dealing with Salicylic Acid. I found this page and wow…Only then I realise I could actually use that little solvent! It is because my formulation has damn high amount of Propylene Glycol and PEG-40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil. 0% Water. Result is very stick and felt weird. So, I left it.
When I tried solubilising 2% Salicylic Acid with 10g Propylene Glycol (according to the chart @ngarayeva001 share on here. I round 9.09g PG up to 10g instead for easy calculation and measurement). It works beautifully!
However, SA crystallises as soon as I add water to SA + PG!
THIS shows exactly it. Which is the reason why that lady says adding Sodium Citrate is imperative. This is a cheat! Sodium Citrate basically neutralises some SA and raises pH a bit.Question: Am I doing/calculating it correctly?
According to my calculations:
(a) if 2% SA + 10g PG =>16.666% SA (Total final ‘volume’ is 12g)
(b) if 2% SA + 10% PG + 88% Water => 2% SA(Total final ‘volume’ is 100g or 100%)
Because it is in % so I naturally would go for (b).
Next, I replaced Water with 52% Ethanol. Et voila! Nice and clear solution!
And next, I replaced PG with PEG-40 HCO. Nice and clear solution as well!
Shines big time on skin but way way less sticky and uneasy feeling than my initial formulation!But, I do not want water in it and I do not want too much PG.
In other words, I want to stay as close as what the chart shows which is using only 10g PG and SA stays 2% and is fully solubilised. Is this even possible to do so? Am I understanding the chart incorrectly? -
Hello Rani.
What I do with my stuff is I dump most of everything in one pot and mix. As long as I have good mixing too OR solution not too thick OR enough water, then it is fine (Citric Acid will be dissolved). I normally do not separate things phase this phase that, heat this that for this that long. Nope, no stability issue maybe I am using inorganic and unnatural stuff. LMAO!
Yes, I do find that the buffer section of Lonza rather confusing. What I gather is they are saying make Sodium Citrate on site. But redundant steps and extra substances used.
I make Sodium Citrate on site because I have no Sodium Citrate and I do not want to buy it when I can easily make it. I mix Sodium Bicarbonate and Citric Acid in one pot. No good and valid reason that I should have extra steps to achieve the same result. Crazy to first put in Sodium Citrate then put in Sodium Hydroxide then finally put in Citric Acid.
Gluconolactone (Glucono-delta-Lactone or GdL) will become Gluconic Acid (probably about 52%) after a while. I do not know how often you check pH. If pH changes only after two weeks then the temperature must be way way low.
The trick to heat GdL. Yes, heat it. This will convert GdL to its acid form quickly and perhaps its ‘final’ form (for lack of better technical description on my part). Heat it with some water and test its pH…et voila! By the power of science vested in me, I shall say you are now pH stable! LOL!
Do not believe in people saying preservatives should be put last or that they are heat-sensitive. Not every preservative behaves the same.
GdL is not even a preservative! The converted Gluconic Acid is also not a preservative! I mean, they are lousy preservatives but only if pH is very low.
Organic acids are weak preservatives and definitely rendered nearly useless if you want to raise pH to that so-called “skin friendly” level as some of them turn into their salt form. Salts are preservatives but only if they are in high concentration.
If organic acids were excellent preservatives then big corporations would have used them because they are organic and natural, can save lots of money and minus extra step adding inorganic and unnatural preservatives.My love is DMDM Hydantoin because it will not only preserve under water but also above water (airspace). Other people see things growing on top of their products, but not me! Oh, DMDM Hydantoin has no known substance which de/inactivate it. Can be heated. Above all, I do not appeal to nature/organic!
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https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1468-2494.2009.00501_2.x
That study shows that (nearly) neutralised Salicylic Acid is a lot less irritating than its acid form. Effectiveness of (nearly) neutralised one is not worse than acid form.
I make mine like that.
About “anti-all-things” property of stuff, I am not sure how true it is. Most of the time it is companies that sell stuff are saying it (they want to sell you things based on your insecurity), as what @EVchem mentioned.
Those that say something works in research (not marketing and and not selling anything) happens a lot in the laboratory, results do not always reflect the same outside of the laboratory.
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Only now I got that “1” symbol as notification!
Thankfully not another one year before I notice you wrote to me! Ha!I do not count how many tests I did. But I know many, many. I started this DIY stuff since 2017.
One of my friends lives in the UK. She always complains about skin too dry. It is common over there due to low temperature and relative humidity. I sent her a sample of dreadfully rich lotion (not cream) and it was still not enough for her. I used it here and I sweat unnaturally as mentioned before. That was based on Behentrimonium Methosulphate and Behentrimonium Chloride. Archaic formulation. Hehehe. This was my earliest copy! Copied from SwiftCraftyMonkey. My first exposure to DIY stuff.
Ah. So, you are also DIY.
The problem with DIY is we do not always get to use “advanced” stuff. Of course money solves all problems whether DIY or not. I do not have too much money. I am not funded. I already have many useless stuff collecting dust and waiting to be thrown away.
Useless stuff = marketing
Generally, I wasted lots of money on marketing. I considered myself paying for a lesson, and lesson learnt!
Since learning much from this site and people, only will I know there is so much bull and cow in this industry as any other industries in the world.
I join gardening/horticulture/agriculture groups (research-based, of course) only from there did I know it also has full of woo-woo of its own. -
OMFAG! I missed your comment! I had not been using this site for some time.
And there is no notification to show me who tags me and who responded to my comment/post. I need to keep the bloody tab/page open! This is the reason why I got bored of this.Do you then ever use it in place of Citric Acid in skincare?Yes, I use GdL exclusively. I hardly use Citric Acid. I never use other acids. I found that the acid form (Gluconic Acid) is way more ‘moisturising’ than Citric Acid.
Moisturising may be a useless terminology (marketing thing). I should say ‘smooth’.Citric Acid tends to provide ‘rough’ feel. I presume that is crystal.
Gluconic Acid does not seem to recrystallise, it becomes sticky instead. This may explain as to why the lack of roughness. Perhaps it was a coincidence. I am not sure; I only did the drying test only one time. I was understood that GdL is an ester. Ester tends to have ‘special properties’.
In other words, I do not use GdL for chelating. It is for feel thing.
Would it also improve the smoothness of an emulsion in the same way that it does for the bean curd?No. It does not make anything smooth like that. LMAO. It is not slippery. It is just another acid stuff.
In heating, do you heat the GdL in water separately before adding to the rest of the formula? How hot does it need to be heated to get the nearly instantaneous acidification that you mention?I heat a solution and see a little water vapour or condensation on beaker wall, and that is all.
No boiling. I have nothing against ‘destroying’ ingredients with high heat. Just that it saves my time. The process can be done easily and quickly, no good reason for me to boil it or heat it for hours on end.No oil phase water phase. All in one pot. Steps to adding in stuff can be at any sequence.
Does the pH drift for some time after in a formulation?Whoa, difficult to impossible question to be answered! It depends on what substances are in the mix. Also, depending on the characteristics of the substances. GdL, for instance, seems like nothing on the pH, but it becomes more and more acidic. Many people who do not know better would wonder why pH was only slightly acidic and then very acidic after a while (or quickly if they heat the solution after pH test). Some also wonder why thickened solution or gel miraculously gets destabilised (liquified) after certain minutes or hours (no heating), if they use good old Carbomer.
I do not follow what cosmetics gurus do. I already had my fair share of being a mindless sheeple. Justified mindlessness as I was starting out so I must not recreate the wheel. First copy what others do and then modify/improve from there. This is the reason why I made a very good product suited for my skin and weather conditions. My friends are using the same thing as I use, and they said they no commercial ones is as good as mine. Not because they are my friends they lick my backside. It is the power of DIY and countless tests. I live in the tropics and most people here are ‘oily’, lots of substances used and recommended in temperate countries are too heavy or greasy for us. Skin will “sweat” and shine prematurely even if the weather is cool. (What is solid in a temperature climate is actually liquid in a tropical climate due to temperate difference. Coupled with very high relative humidity. Thus, lots of oily stuff are marvellous over there, horrible over here)
All I need is a bit of understanding of how things works. And some experimentations, of course. Because asking people and not a single test on my side I will never experience what others are saying/doing, I will for ever be asking and guessing, and very likely be following the Dunning-Kruger graph like those natrel-oganik-eko-sustaainibel-respncible activists debating from their arse.
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You are welcome. o:)
Now that is odd. Why not ask that someone who gave you a bunch of the water for data?
That someone does not know then ask that someone for the source.
Or else pray hard. LOL!
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I do my best to read and understand your need without bias because it is normal for people to be experimental or to DIY (for various personal reasons). However, I am very sure that this is a topic that people on this site will not answer. Those who answer could very likely be Indigo Children, they may even tell you how to make their secret sauce to inject in order to kill COVID!
Perhaps…maybe…probably… …You could cunningly rephrase what you want to achieve in a new post. :p
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1) You DO NOT USE PARABENS? No problem! Use DMDM Hydantoin! I am not telling you what it is other than it is VERY EFFECTIVE AND SAFE is used as recommended. 0.5% to 0.6% usage rate. You could use less but…I, for one, do not want to take the risk of stupidly making myself suffer from preventable skin ailments. I might even go blind!
2) How is not using chelating agent very bad? You are fine if you use distilled water. I never use distilled water. I use deionised water bought from petrol station, for battery use! :p
3) Maybe adding Citric Acid helps to act as buffer for Urea. From my humble experience, all is fine if I use up the finished product quickly.
In case you wonder why the heck I am talking about, I invite you to read THIS. Madly long and technical, but amazing! Amazing to me, that is! Hehehehehehehe!
I probably could not help you further than this due to my finite experience and knowledge. I make things for myself only, not for selling, thus I do not have question about what (named) products to use. I do not go by products nor allow names of companies to determine what I want to make. I dislike to limit myself to named products. Meaning, let us say that I could not find Myritol, I could use Capric/Caprylic Triglyceride on the rack in any pharmacies. Many pharmacy staff and pharmacists here think that I am an arrogant fool because I never tell them names of drugs, I utter the actual chemical names instead.
Besides that, very often, substances that have ‘cosmetics’ label of them prices are very high, I am not doing a business with what I make so I will not earn back the money. But the high price is sometimes, only sometimes, justified because those are usually highly purified (I mean deodorised). Capric/Caprylic Triglyceride at a pharmacy does have ‘goat’ smell as it is. Myritol may not have much of that smell as it is modified one (According to what BASF website writes).
Xanthan Gum is similar. Cheap/common Xanthan Gum (yellowish powder) from bakery shop has an uneasy scent, odour gets a bit worse when mixes in water. For sometime I wondered why the heck my product has shitty scent. Expensive Xanthan Gum from Jungbunzlauer (white powder) has scent but not uneasy, odour becomes imperceptible in water.
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Here you go!
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1468-2494.2009.00501_2.x
You are welcome!
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LMAO. Another secretive individual with national secret formulation.
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Heheheh. I am confused as well!
What @Pharma meant by “it’s easier to just add citric acid and then start adding NaOH until you hit pH 5″ is like this….
Step 1 : Add random amount (or a set amount) of Citric Acid.Step 2 : Add ‘some’ alkali (of your choice) to Citric Acid bit by bit until you get the desired pH.
Even expert chemists need to do that manually. Yes, manually. Mathematics is dead. LOL! I joke but I ‘suffered’ that way when I tried to get the purrrrfect pH/buffer for my lovely Urea, my Obsessive Compulsive Disorder of accuracy must get that 99.999999% spot on pH number. I thought maths was infallible because it is…maths! I was restless battling with maths demanding it to tell me as to why it betrays humanity. I ended up adjusting the pH manually and sleep soundly. Not spot on pH but way less work punching in the numbers and wondering why they are not matching in reality.
Ah I see what you are trying to achieve. You want pH from start to finish!
You would need an MLM rubbish shower attachment which claims to constantly makes water either alkaline or acidic. (Sounds like an ion exchange resin but not that simple and straightforward! It is MLM!)
I am not trying to insult you but in where I live, few MLM companies really do sell thing like that. They even have infrared and magnetic shower attachments!
In all seriousness, I do not think you need buffer!
All you need is a pool of water, make that water pH 5 with lots of Citric Acid (or other acids), et voila!
But it must be a pool of water, because running water from the main is not buffered at low pH nor naturally low pH. This means if the (water) main is pH 8 then it will keep changing the pH of anything it touches to alkaline.
You have control over a pool of water but not the main.If you are selling baby shampoo to other people then you have no control over how they use the product, let alone ask them to collect a pool of water and make it pH 5. Not many people are willing to go to that length if their babies do not have skin issues.
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Polyols such as Propylene Glycol and Propanediol are an option but they are needed in large amount.
I responded to THIS a few minutes ago.
There is a study which states neutralised (near ph 7) Salicylic Acid is as good as Salicylic Acid at low pH. It is a common knowledge that ALL acids must be in low pH to be effective. Salicylic Acid is an exception to the rule.
I made both Salicylic Acid and Sodium Salicylate solutions. Difference is negligible. But Sodium Salicylate is way less irritating than Salicylic Acid due to pH not crazy low.
Use this page to help you with the neutralisation. It is all set up for you, just punch in the numbers. But you still need to check with pH strip or metre! Purity of the substance, temperature, and so forth, can influence the actual numbers.
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Propanediol or Propylene Glycol AND Polysorbate (some numbers of your choice).
But you would need A LOT of Propanediol/Propylene Glycol (depending on the amount of Salicylic Acid).
Surfactant such as Polysorbate lessens the use of those glycols as it also helps with the solubility of Salicylic Acid.
You could add in Alcohol.
Alcohol is the primary solvent of Salicylic Acid in corn/callus/warts remover.
The more solvents mixed together the merrier. It means you use less of either one, by doing this it reduces whatever irritation that one substances may cause. Similar to a mixture of preservatives is normally more effective and less irritating that maxing out on only one preservative and hoping that that one preservative is Godly.
There is some things for everyone to be sensitive about anyway. -
Hello @Soona
A few people here will scream at you and will not help you.
If you ask that it means you have no idea what you are dealing with.Azelaic Acid and Salicylic Acid are automatically considered drugs at that high amount.
I would like to help but… I rather let real chemists/pharmacists here to it.
Basically…It is not easy to answer which is formula is better.
“Better” for me is 3% Salicylic Acid, and approximately 10% Sodium Salicylate (neutralised Salicylic Acid. Near pH 7. No irritation. No soothing agent needed).Those two formulations are the best for me because I cannot get Azelaic Acid to play with, and I dislike the odour of Sulphur.
I take Urea, for instance, as I have pretty rich experience playing with it. Some people say less than 5% is moisturising, above 5% is exfoliating. Some people say 3% is more than enough to hydrate skin. Whatever they say, I test/ed it out, on myself. Because what people say can be very different from what happens to me. 40% Urea does not exfoliate me, maybe I already have perfect skin. LMAO! 2% to 10% is not hydrating.
It is difficult to one-size-fits-all, in other words. What your application is, and whatnot. As with 40% Urea, very high amount of Salicylic Acid at 10% (not neutralised; very low pH) does not exfoliate my skin. Even the combination of very high amount of Urea and Salicylic Acid do not act as chemical peel on me. Because I have not much ‘dead skin’ to observe the typical result that people are talking about.
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Thank you very much @Pharma . I invite you to explain more, whenever possible for you to do so.
Whatever knowledge from you is most helpful no matter how short it is! At least you answer in full, I think, because I learn so much from you and it is the reality! Etched in my fatty blob between my ears. Lots of weird stuff that are not taught in skoolz.
I could understand why you are not the kind of person who tells people “Use this brand. Use that substance. Don’t argue” because you are an educator-esque and you wrote some mad thing. It is always very good to have people like you who neither selling products nor follow a product simply because a company/manufacturer says it is the best.
Anyway, you indirectly gave me a new assignment. LOL! I plan to purchase 99.9% Ethanol to purify Lecithin. I can get that aforementioned deoiled Lecithin and 99.9% EtOH inexpensively, so there is no harm to having fun with it and learning new stuff. You make it sound easy. I got this, and it does look easy.
However, I do not know what to watch out for other than PC will precipitate in EtOH. LMAO. Maybe a coffee filter could filter the precipitation, whatever that is soluble in EtOH will drip/leak out of the coffee filter.
Hmm. Sadly, Tocopherol and Ascorbyl Palmitate are VERY expensive. As expensive as Trimethylglycine which you mentioned here. I will use BHT instead.
0.1% BHT of 2% Lecithin is 0.001%.
My weighing scale although reads 0.001g, minimum mass needs to be at least 5g to 9g for the thing to move.
I will measure it as ‘final volume’ - 20g finished product, 0.02g BHT.
I can only hope that BHT will not become pro-oxidant because 0.02g is 10 times more than 0.002g as it is not based on the amount of Lecithin.Ah. I understand now. Hydrogenated Lecithin is only good as barrier, not much penetrative power, not much of a carrier of active.
Normal Lecithin behaves the opposite of Hydrogenated Lecithin.
Mix them to get the best qualities of the two.
I tried getting hydrogenated one but to no avail.Oh no I am not going to make my own hydrogenated Lecithin. LOL. The processes and materials required to hydrogenating common cooking oil already frighten me.
Ah ha! Lecithin is SUSPENDED in water! I presumed that it forms vesicle and end of story. Because this is the impression that the Internet gives me - Lecithin is merely a skin-like carrier, good for nothing else.
I can now ‘see’ it in my mind’s eye how it actually works! It deposits a film of lipid on skin. No wonder a bloody simple Lecithin & Water mixture works very well on my skin condition.
Skin appears terribly greasy but surprisingly no greasy feel even when it is thickly applied. Strangely sticky but not sticky the way humectants are. -
Ah! This confirms my preconceived notion as to why many so-called “humectant”. I am looking for confirmation biases! LMAO!
Perhaps they are technically humectants but only when relative humidity is very very high. Otherwise, they (Urea, Trehalose, Erythritol) recrystallise as water evaporates.
They do not behave as Sorbitol, Glycerol, nor Fructose, in other words.
Sorbitol and Fructose once touch with water, they need tremendous amount of energy to have their ‘captured’ water removed.
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This post suddenly is about Urea. LMAO!
You (whoever) really need to read and understand THIS because it is all-you-need-to-know about how to formulating with Urea. I asked the most questions and fortunately @Pharma is the only one who was willing to entertain me in full. He suddenly went silent, I do not know why. But enough data for me to safely and peacefully carry on my experiments.
Summary: Maintain pH at 6.2, mix something to achieve eutectic solution.
I have samples at approximately pH 6 and some are low pH (2-4). I keep them in vacuum pump bottle. They expand very little that it does not matter, this is after one year. I live in the tropics, temperature is very high, Urea should be hydrolysed even quicker, but still does not matter.
Urea will recrystallise if a solution is only Urea and Water. This is the confusing part, people say Urea is a humectant and very hygroscopic, but makes no sense how can it be hygroscopic when it becomes crystals once water is evaporated, yes? Beats me! No body can answer this. LOL!
Because Urea recrystallises, something else must be added to Urea such as Glycerol, Sorbitol, Sucrose, etc. Basically anything that will not recrystallise once hydrated. So that formation of Urea crystals is prevented. (Fun fact: Another confusing ‘humectant’ which is said to be superior or the best is Sodium Hyaluronate/Hyaluronic Acid. This will become flaky/dried)
I have been making moisturiser with Urea as the main celebrity for three years, it is difficult to go wrong with it.
Lotion Crafter, Humblebeeandme, Swiftcraftymonkey, and the likes of them are not truly into what most actual chemists and pharmacists in this site are doing. DIY sites are regurgitating whatever they read on companies/makers’ brochure. When they say they do their ‘research’, their research is Google University that anybody can do.
Some DIY sites are obsessed with PubMed or other sciency sites, they whip out circular argument always pointing back to PubMed or other sciency sites. PubMed says 40% Urea is hydrating, they made 40% Urea cream and complained Urea is drying and irritating, suddenly Urea got bad reputation. PubMed says Glycerol makes skin healthy, they slapped on neat Glycerol and complained Glycerol burns and causes itching, suddenly Glycerol got bad reputation.
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Their descriptions are exactly as described.
The expensive one is less stringy or less snotty then go for the ‘soft’ one. But it has less suspending property. You may need to use more than 0.2% or 0.3%.
The cheap one is normal Xanthan Gum with all things Xanthan Gum. It is stringy/snotty and has very high suspending quality. The only differences is this one is made transparent (further purified).
Depends on the result or effect that you need.
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Strange. I wonder why the big guns are not answering this.
No, Xanthan Gum is not responsible for the clog.
Many shampoo/wash are without Xanthan Gum or any other fancy thickeners. They all still clog big time, and stalactite and stalagmite can clearly be seen! LMAO!
You could add Glycerol/Glycerine to mitigate that effect. However, you will lose foam. I do not know about this part of the chemistry but it will kill foam.
As for snot, Xanthan Gum is inherently stringy or snotty.
You may try Xanthan Gum mesh 200.
Mesh 200 is approximately 75 micrometres.
This refers to particle size of Xanthan Gum.
Common one is mesh 80; approx. 180 micrometres.I am using Jungbunzlauer mesh 200 Xanthan Gum. I do not see snot. Result is oh-so smooth! But, I cannot say it is the same for you because I do not use much of it. Having said this, mesh 80 one definitely is snot-like at the same %.
0.5% mesh 80 = Snot. Mysterious miniature blobs (Result of my laziness and no suitable equipment). Nightmare.
0.5% mesh 200 = Smooth as f*ck. Not much elbow grease needed. I can skip the retard/slow down hydration step. No special equipment required. I can be lazy and sleep well.
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@Perry
I have experienced this (especially after going for a run then showering)This is common. And this the reason why High Intensity Interval Training can have fat-burning effect which lasts for many hours even when you are at rest or asleep.
It is the high content of lipids in your formulation. I live in Malaysia, in the tropics. High temperature plus high relative humidity is very bad in many ways. I struggled much wondering what was wrong with me. LMAO! That was when I started making my own moisturiser; I was a noob. I still experienced the same because I copied formulations of temperate climate exactly. I later learnt that I am not the only one experiencing weirdness.
Also, I learnt that advice and methods suited for temperate climate cannot be applied in the tropics. Same goes for gardening/agriculture. I killed many lavender and rosemary in the past just because I allowed them to go ‘dry’ and ‘under full sun’, which is the only advice to growing those species successfully.
I will tell you my story. More like jouney.
My very first DIY moisturiser was with Behentrimonium Chloride/Methosulphate. Only 3% but it is too rich. I wondered why as I saw sweat on my nose immediately after I applied the moisturiser.
After knowing Behentrimonium Chrloride/Methosulphate is too rich, I moved to using Cetyl Alcohol. Same thing. Very low amount but I sweat. I wondered why.
I tried many substances over the years. Much effort and money gone down the drain. That was when I learnt that many stuff such as Hyaluronic Acid/Sodium Hyaluronate, Saccharide Isomerate (trade name is ‘Pentavitin’), etc, are just marketing. Companies like that are no different to doctors. Doctors may know how a drug work but impossible that they know which one works for which individual with which specific sickness, especially new drugs are constantly churning out in the name of money. Many of them nowadays are promoting natural and organic cures! Pharmacists are the same, telling people to swallow certain organic/natural supplements as cure! Medical science is dead. The good old day chemist (named ‘pharmacist’ in modern days) is dead.
My formulation got stupid simpler and simpler, and stupidly minimalistic. Zero lipid and very very small amount of humectants.
Sorbitol
Xanthan Gum
Glucono delta Lactone (basically hydrolysed into gluconic acid and lactone once it touches water)
DMDM Hydantoin
Potassium SorbateYeah! That simple! Absolutely zero commercial value. Most substances are from the bakery shop! But it is all right because it is for my own use, and it is perfect for my oily skin and the climate that I am in. I gave few samples to a few friends and they said excellent, so they actually pay me to provide them with the product.