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Solubilizer polysorbate 80
Hello,
I’m having a really difficult time solubilizing a small amount of oil (1 %) into water without ending up with a cloudy result. I’ve tried mixing the oil and poly80 before adding the water. This resulted in a big glob that stuck to the glass rod I was stirring with. Heating up the mixture dissolved the glob and appeared to fix the cloudiness until it was stirred again.The ratio’s I’ve tested are 1:1, 1:2, 1:3, 1:4, 1:5, oil:poly80. The result was a cloudy mixture, every time. I haven’t been able to find information about proper instructions aside from anecdotal data from various forums/blogs. But I’ve seen and know that people can successfully create a clear solution with only these ingredients. If anyone could point me in the right direction, that would be wonderful. Thanks!
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11 Replies
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Which oil are you trying to solubilize?
Have you tried any other solubilizer e.g PEG40 hydrogenated castor oil?
What is the purpose of your solubilized oil?
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Hey johnb, thanks for swift reply.
The oil I’m using is sweet almond oil, and the only other solubilizer I’ve tried is poly20 which produced the exact same results.
I don’t really have a purpose for the product other than experimentation. I have this other product where poly80 is supposed to solubilize 1 % tocopherol but it failed. So I thought I’d see if the same thing would happen with 1 % sweet almond oil. -
Are you pre-mixing the oil with the Polysorbate 80? IT should be pre-mixed and a homogeneous mixture obtained. Then it is added to the water. For brevity, it is usually best to start at a 5 Poly 80 to 1 oil ratio. This usually works and you can titrate downwards.
That said, I have always gotten better results with PEG-40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil.
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I think that you will have to increase the amount of solubilizer to enable a clear almond oil/water mixture.
Personally, I’ve never had much success with polysorbates (doesn’t mean that you won’t). I find other surfactants (e.g castor oil derivatives) more suitable.
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@Microformulation: I did that a couple of times, but when water was added the oil mixture stuck to the stirrer and wouldn’t dissolve. I’ll give it a few more attempts. Maybe apply heat while premixing them together?
@johnb: Yeah, seems like polysorbates are a pain to work with. In an emulsion system however they are easy to incorporate.Guess I’ll try to get a hold of PEG-40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil like both of you suggested. It seems to be the gold standard for solubilizing oils into water.
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You will likely need to heat the mixture to decrease the viscosity to get good solubulization.
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I think I spotted your problem. You need to mix your oil with poly80 in one beaker, stop and clean your mixing blade, then in a second beaker, add your water, start mixing, and add the poly80/oil mixture drop by drop. This can’t be done with a mixing rod, either - you need a prop mixer, or a reasonable substitute.
When you added water to the poly80/oil mixture, you made a w/o emulsion, which at some point, stopped accepting more water - hence the “blob”. The heat broke the emulsion, but then there wasn’t enough solubilizer to make it clear.
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@Microformulation: unfortunately that didn’t work either.
@Bobzchemist: thank you for your insight Robert! I’ll try this once I get a hold of a proper mixer. -
@Bobzchemist so rightfully pointed out your issue is in the process (manufacturing). This really needs effective mixing over a period of time. A proper mixer is key.
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If you continue to have problems with Polysorbate80, you might try Seppiclear G7 (Heptyl Glucoside) or PolySugaMulse D9.
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I have found that when trying to solubilise fragrances that sometimes a combination of solubilisers works better than just one. Maybe you can try a blend PEG-40 Hydrogenated castor oil and Polysorbate 20.
You could also try increasing the solubiliser ratio.
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