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Increasing gel cream viscosity
Hello!
I’m trying to formulate a lightweight face gel cream for personalized skincare (treatment aftercare). The sample got an approval and comedogenicity was evaluated by our dermatologist, but I need to achieve something that can be scooped out of a jar.The base formula is:Water up to 1003.20 % - Cetearyl olivate, sorbitan olivate (Olivem 1000)3.00 % - Dimethicone2.00 % - Glycerin2.00 % - Propanediol1.50 % - Cyclomethicone0.25 % - Squalane0.22 % - Octyldodecanol0.20 % - Xanthan gum (Rheocare)0.20 % - Sodium Potassium Aluminum Silicate and Titanium Dioxide and Silica 0.2 %0.15 % - Phosphatidylcholine0.15 % - Polyglyceryl-4 Caprate0.10 % - Glyceryl Stearate SELower than 0.2% each, not more than 1,5% combined:plant extracts, Pentavitin, Tocopherol, Hyaluronic acid, Phenoxyethanol, Ethylhexylglycerin, TromethamineI centrifuged the hell out of it (4000g), and in 40C after a month now it is still going strong.What are your ideas to ramp up the viscosity without changing the skin feel much? I was thinking about siligel or ecogel and lowering phosphatidylcholine (as they contain lecithin), but I would have to order those. I’m located in europe, and not able to place large raw material orders as our batch sizes are really small (no more than 3 kilos).This is my first post on this forum and I definitely plan to be more of a giver instead of being just a taker
Happy to be a part of this community!
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13 Replies
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@michalby If you just want to increase viscosity, you sould add a high HLB emulsifier (like Polisorbate-80 or Ceteareth-20). If you want to have a cream gel consistency, you could add a polymeric emulsifier like Sepigel 305.
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Hmm, I’m not sure about increasing the viscosity of the cream with a liquid surfactant such as polisorbate. Ceteareth-20 - fine, but it’s comedogenicity or waxiness might be a problem, I would realy love to keep the skin feel as light as possible.
I forgot to mention that the pH of the cream is 5.5. I haven’t tried carbopol ultrez-30 but I’ve made a batch with a pH of 6.2 and added a regular carbomer (that is viscous at a pH 6-7) it was a bit “crunchy” or “chunky” and it was sliding on a palm a bit like a gel hand sanitizer. -
If you’re willing to add Ecogel, I would just as soon add an additional 0.1%-0.2% of gum — either a high-quality xanthan, Solagum, or sclerotium.
And are you sure that’s sufficient preservative?
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@michalby Because you have a liquid emulsifier, that doesn’t necessarily means you’ll have a liquid emulsion. The emulsifiers interacts with other ingredients to create the emulsion, so in this case, addind a high HLB emulsifier to an existing low HLB emulsifier can turn the lamellae into a more robust interface. Also, even though ceteareth-20 looks waxy, it is by no means similar to paraffin wax.
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suswang8 said:If you’re willing to add Ecogel, I would just as soon add an additional 0.1%-0.2% of gum — either a high-quality xanthan, Solagum, or sclerotium.
And are you sure that’s sufficient preservative?
So a 0.3-0.5% Ecogel plus 0.3-0.4% xanthan? Ok, I’ll try that! Is the ecogel here killing that stringy slimy xanthan skin feel?Phenoxyethanol (and) Ethylhexylglycerin are at 0.4% (combined), I haven’t had any problems with that amount to date. Do you think it’s necessary to increase it or add another preservative?Pattsi said:https://www.neutrogena.com/products/skincare/neutrogena-hydro-boost-water-gel-with-hyaluronic-acid-for-dry-skin/6811047.htmlhttps://www.neutrogena.co.uk/face/moisturisers/hydro-boost-water-gel#ingredients
Yeah, I see the polyacrylamide, carbomer and vinyl dimethicone crosspolymer, I suppose they achieved that smooth gel consistency with a specific combination of these. Neutrogena hydro boost was a reference, along with Clinique Moisture Surge, Laneige Water Bank and Watermelon Glow Sleeping Mask (although it was slimy in my opinion).
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Regarding gums, I was saying that if you are willing to add in Ecogel, which is mostly gums , the easiest thing for you to do would be to just add a bit more gum — I don’t think you need both Ecogel and xanthan. I would use a high-quality xanthan and perhaps just increase the concentration by 0.1%-0.2% above what you have now and see if you like the result, but if skin feel is very important, you are probably better off adding in an additional gum like sclerotium or Solagum. Most importantly, how significant of a change are you looking for? A minor one, or a dramatically thicker product?Regarding preservatives, if that is working via your testing, then I am not going to fault it, but I think 0.2% phenoxyethanol is considered quite low. I assume you are adding in each of these components individually and not adding them as part of a pre-formulated, combined preservative?
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I’ve included just 0.2% of xanthan in my formula, because the difference between 0.2 and 0.3% was unnoticeable (so there’s no point in increasing it). 0.4% although a tiny bit more viscous (still not enough to make the product suitable for a jar) was already slimy and even a bit stringy. I’ll order siligel and try with sclerotium/xanthan combination now.A pea-sized (~1ml) blob stays on the skin without running or sliding. But scooping it out of the jar is unsatisfactory. Like dipping a finger in apple sauce, just a coating remains and nothing is really being scooped out. It’s meant to be light, just not that light ::wink:suswang8 said:[…]Regarding preservatives, if that is working via your testing, then I am not going to fault it, but I think 0.2% phenoxyethanol is considered quite low. I assume you are adding in each of these components individually and not adding them as part of a pre-formulated, combined preservative?
This particular formula is not yet tested for microbial contamination after long storage and/or use. But I’ve successfully used that preservative combination before and tests came out fine.
I’ll keep you guys updated. -
you can try konjac with xanthan gum. They have good synergy for viscosity. -
You might need Sepicgel305 or Aristoflex AVC to give a little body like @ketchito mentioned - easy to find.
Neutrogena - Sepicgel305
Clinique, Laneige - Aristoflex AVC -
michalby said:suswang8 said:[…]Regarding preservatives, if that is working via your testing, then I am not going to fault it, but I think 0.2% phenoxyethanol is considered quite low. I assume you are adding in each of these components individually and not adding them as part of a pre-formulated, combined preservative?
This particular formula is not yet tested for microbial contamination after long storage and/or use. But I’ve successfully used that preservative combination before and tests came out fine.
I’ll keep you guys updated.Out of curiosity, are you using a pre-formulated blend of both preservatives (i.e., already combined)? Or are you individually adding each component at 0.2%?
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It’s a preformulated blend of 9:1 phenoxyethanol and ethylhexylglycerin at 0.4%, I oversimplified it in my original formula description, sorry.
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