Help with process

Formulating

Help with process

Posted by Kyle_T on June 6, 2018 at 5:13 pm

Hey guys, I got some great advice last month from you all regarding a Matte Paste (Pomade/clay) I am formulating. Thanks to your help I now have a stable emulsion and perfect samples on the bench. We

We are now running pilot batches before we truly scale up to full size, and I have some bugs in my process (I think) that you all may have some insight on.

here are the two issues I am having:

1. Finished product cannot be spread accross hands for application without leaving small globs of product that wont work in without considerable effort.

These globs could come off in customers hair. This does not happen with samples before scaling.

2. Kaolin does not seem to disperse correctly, and when the product sets, small chunks can be seen on the top. This isn’t a huge deal, more about aesthetics, however we are using a very high quality, sterilized, colloidal kaolin. This issue also does not happen before scaling.

Phase A:

Water

Kaolin

Propylene Glycol

PVP K90

Panthenol DL

Pemulen Tr2

Disodium EDTA

Phase B:

Lanolin Wax

Stearyl Behenate

Cetyl Alcohol

Stearyl Alochol

Peg 40 Hydrogenated Castor Oil

Petrolatum

Ceteareth-25

Glyceral Monostearate

Phase C:

Euxel PE 90

Fragrance

My thoughts are that:

A. Running the product through a homogenizer could solve both issues. I have a small and a large one, so could easily scale up or down to test this. my current pilot batch is too large/small for either though.

B. Should we add Kaolin later in the process? It is currently in our water phase, which is heated to 70-75c. Would I be better off waiting until phase A & B (Water & Oil) are combined, and putting in once mixed down to 55-60c?

B. Do we need to add additional polymers, possibly vp/va copolymer?

C. We previously had tapioca starch in the formula (phase A), which gave some volume and texture in the hair, and we removed it thinking that it was reacting to heat was causing gelling/”globs”, after removal they are still present. Should I add it back to the formula or keep this variable removed?

D. Leave as is or replace Stearyl Behenate with Tribehenate? or remove completely?

Thank you again for all of your help!

- Kyle

MMJez replied 6 years, 9 months ago 3 Members · 4 Replies
4 Replies

Kyle_T

Member
June 7, 2018 at 3:15 pm

Figured I’d update you guys on my progress in case it can help someone else out in a similar situation.

We played with removing the tapioca starch with zero success, which led us to conclude that we have to homogenize.

Homogenizing on the bench worked great with an overhead mixer yesterday and today we are running a batch through our inline rotor stator mixer.

I will let you all know how it turns out!
MMJez

Member
June 9, 2018 at 4:22 pm

Hey, Kyle!

I think you should try adding clay into oilphase and then combining A and B phase (w/o or vice versa). At least we are doing it that way and it is working for us. Keep me updated on your process!

M.M.J
Gunther

Member
June 9, 2018 at 4:47 pm

Does Kaolin really does anything useful and actually noticeable to hair?
How about lowering it to claims ingredient levels?
And grind it to semi-micronize it with a ball mill or something, before adding it to the formula.

Sorry, perhaps I’m missing something but I just don’t see how Kaolin can do something for hair
other than feeling gritty and powdery (dandruff-like at high levels) when the rest of the formula dries out.
MMJez

Member
June 9, 2018 at 7:23 pm

actually using it right it will not dry out and it is used mainly to make your product matte and gritty.

Kyle_T

MMJez

Gunther

MMJez