• Formulating

  Clouding and viscosity issues encountered with different manufacturers using my CDE

  Posted by sendtoryan on February 15, 2019 at 8:39 am

  Dear All,

  Hoping to get some opinions on the results gotten from various test results from various manufacturers. Detailed formulation compositions were not provided by the customers as all test done were just a direct substitution of  different CDE used i.e Ours vs Brand X. Our CDE usually have a free amine content of about 5 - 6%. I understand many users here do not like using CDE here due to the Carcinogenic warnings but i would like to stay with CDE now to determine what went wrong in the cases below. 

  Case Condition 1 - Company 1

  Substitution of CDE sample in Detergent sample.

   

  Stabilization Test

   

  Background – Submitted
  a sample of my CDE as a substitution against a competitor’s CDE in the
  manufacturing of detergent.  The same
  formulation ratios were maintained with the difference only being 2 different brands
  of CDE used for comparison. The active CDE ratio used in the detergent is 8%. The
  test is left under the conditions for 4 weeks. My sample failed the – 5 degC
  test.

   

  Before
  Test of 4 weeks

  Appearance: Clear

  Colour: Pale
  yellowish

  PH : 7.5

  Viscosity: 1778

  Concentration: 14.8

   

  After Test of 4 weeks

   

  Test 1 Results - Under
  Room Temperature.

  Appearance: Clear

  Colour: Pale
  yellowish

  PH : 7.5

  Viscosity: 1882

  Concentration: 14.4

  Results : Pass

   

  Test 2 Results - Under
  -5 degree.

  Appearance: Cloudy

  Colour: Cloudy

  PH : Not measured

  Viscosity: Not
  measured

  Concentration: Not
  measured

  Result: “FAIL”. It becomes cloudy in 2 days under -5
  degree condition

   

  Test 3 Results - Under
  50 degree

  Appearance: Clear

  Colour: Pale
  yellowish

  PH : 8.0

  Viscosity: 1362

  Concentration: 14.5

  Result: Pass

   

  Test 4 Results - Under
  Sunlight

  Appearance: Clear

  Colour: Pale
  yellowish

  PH : 7.3

  Viscosity: 1900

  Concentration: 14.7

  Result: Pass

   

   

  Questions

  What is causing the
  cloudiness at -5 degrees in this case? Why is one sample at good with a 8% CDE composition while ours is not good. Is it because their CDE has a much higher free amine than ours? How can i rectify this? 

   

   

   

  Case Condition 2 - Company 2

   

  Stabilization Test

   

  Background – Customer
  produced their detergent using 3 samples of our CDE and 1 sample of their usual
  supplier CDE.

   

  All 3 samples of the
  detergent using our samples of CDE got cloudy after heating at 50 degrees. Clouding
  observed to start from 35 degc onwards. The picture bellows shows the condition
  at 50 degrees.

   

  After 24 hours, the
  CDE is found floating at the top of the liquid on all 3 samples. However, after
  shaking the mixture, the solution becomes clear again. So we failed on the
  cloudiness and the difference in viscosity within the detergent sample. The sample containing the competitors CDE remains clear after heating at 50 degrees.

   

  Question: What is the
  cause of the cloudiness and the separation given all other conditions remains the
  same??

   

  Case Condition 3 - Company C

   

  Result   : NG

  Reason: All conditions being the same. The viscosity of the end product
  using my CDE is lower than our Competitors (Kawaken’s). The detergent sample
  viscosity test results using our CDE was 1100 cps at 25 degree and 140 cps at
  60 degree, our Competitors viscosity is measured at 160 – 220 cps at 50 degree.

   

  They therefore had to more of our CDE into the formulation thus making it not
  cost effective for them.

   

  Question: What affects the viscosity of CDE that enables it to make such a
  biff difference between our sample vs their sample??

  sendtoryan replied 5 years, 9 months ago 1 Member · 0 Replies
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