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On Hyaluronic acid and L’ascorbic acid
Just curious to know if HA and LAA dissolves in glycerin and if HA turns to gel in it. If yes, can glycerin be heated without degrading ?
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8 Replies
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@Perry @ngarayeva001 @Microformulation what do you guys think… Thinking of making an anhydrous vitamin c serum and want to find a way to incorporate HA and if possible, extracts, infused in glycerin using double boiler and when cooled down, dissolve the LAA and HA in it, ferulic then how do I go about the emulsifying phase using vitamin e oil ? Since I can’t re-heat the dissolved ascorbic acid with the HA(assuming and hoping it dissolves in glycerin) I’m worried it will destroy the acid and HA. The aim of the serum is for brightening hyperpigmentation, tackle wrinkles, dark spots and even complexion
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I know that LAA dissolves in light Dimethicone, Propanediol (tested myself) and Propylene Glycol.
Now, if you use so much of propanediol (which is a solvent and a humectant), there is no need in adding HA. You will just not notice the difference. I do not recommend using glycerin. The final product will be very sticky.I suspect that HA can be dissolved in silicone. Look at the LOI of The Ordinary Vitamin C Suspension 23% + HA Spheres 2%:
Ascorbic Acid, Squalane, Isodecyl Neopentanoate, Isononyl Isononanoate, Coconut Alkanes, Ethylene/Propylene/Styrene Copolymer, Ethylhexyl Palmitate, Silica Dimethyl Silylate, Sodium Hyaluronate, Glucomannan, Coco-Caprylate/Caprate, Butylene/Ethylene/Styrene Copolymer, Acrylates/Ethylhexyl Acrylate Crosspolymer, Trihydroxystearin, BHT
However, even if you can dissolve it, I know than many experts on this forum expressed their doubts that LAA can be stabilised this way. Thus, derivatives are better for the commercial use. There is a very good podcast on the beauty brains on Vitamin C derivatives. -
Oh btw @Majman, look at this product!
https://www.cultbeauty.co.uk/the-ordinary-ascorbic-acid-8-alpha-arbutin-2.html
Just three ingredients: Propanediol, Ascorbic Acid, Alpha-Arbutin
Maybe you can try to make this? Should be simple and perfect for marketing claims!Another related topic. I recently read about ethyl ascorbic acid. The suppliers claim that it’s stabilised LAA (I don’t understand if it’s a derivative or not, becase it doesn’t have to be converted to LAA in skin). Anybody knows if it’s working?
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@ngarayeva001If you look closely at “The Ordinary’s” product, you will see that THEY are not dissolving the L-AA in Silicone, they are using a pre-made product from Jeen International.What the fascination with L-AA? It is a wasteful rabbit hole you are all going down. Derivatives, pre-milled anhydrous forms FROM THE DISTRIBUTOR, etc. Avoid Ferulic acid since you are impinging on a patent. A massive dose of L-AA is a one-dimensional product.Use a stable derivative, especially if this is new to you. -
@Microformulation, I am not arguing that it’s a rabbit hole. I did many experiements (and our previous discussions on the forum motivated me to read a lot) on L-AA and know it oxydizes very fast. I just shared my knowledge on what exists in the market at the moment.
By the way The Ordinary also have another product with silicones.LOI: Dimethicone, Ascorbic Acid, Polysilicone-11, PEG-10 Dimethicone.
L-AA is used at 30% there.. Not sure what I think about it, but both products are not very pleasant to apply, so I have never tried to repeat it. I personally don’t like propanediol based products either.
May I ask your opinion on 3-0 Ethyl Ascorbic Acid?
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Silicones are great. One of the limitations of “naturally compliant” Formulations is the loss of these materials. The LAA silicone product you refer to is a Jeen International product. I have used it before.I have used the 3-0 Ethyl Ascorbate. It works as well as the other derivatives.More importantly, do you have a balanced product or are you like many and “Vitamin C, I need more, nothing else matters, Perricone has 20%, I want 21%!” Believe me, I hear it all the time. Vitamin C derivatives can potentiate with other products. Also, age-related discolorations are also accompanied by other signs of aging which should be addressed.
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Thank you @Microformulation. I absolutely agree that skin needs more than one ingredient. I do not use Vitamin C alone, it is a part of my routine which includes many other ingredients (multiple products), and I don’t recommend others relying on one ingredient either.
Crafters websites do not have the 3-0 Ethyl Ascorbate yet. I saw it on ebay (they ship from the US), but I am a bit uncertain if buying actives from ebay is safe…
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Thanks guys!
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