[Eugene]

Perry said:

In my opinion, I could create a formula using just Water, Glycerin, Xanthan gum, and Caprylyl/Capryl Glucoside and get all the moisture boosting benefits you would get from making the formula you are attempting. 

The reality is that most of the ingredients you are adding are “claims” ingredients that are put in formulas to tell stories to consumers to get them to buy otherwise uninteresting (but effective) products. These ingredients, especially the plant extracts, are having no effect in your formula at all. 

I know the companies marketing these raw materials, the brands using them, and the unwitting bloggers who write about them will tell you different, but their opinions are biased. They are motivated to get you to buy something. They rely on you to buy into the story of ingredients. 

Aloe is a humectant. Glycerin is a humectant. But glycerin is so much more efficient and effective at being a humectant that with it in your formula, you will see zero benefit from aloe. Therefore, the ONLY reason companies add aloe is so they can tell the story that the product has aloe. People are much more inclined to buy a product with aloe than one with glycerin. 

Everything sounds even worse than I expected ))) But as you said, if I won’t add such components to formula it won’t be interesting to consumers. 

[Eugene]

Perry said:

@Eugene - the only group of scientists you should listen to when it comes to chemical safety is Toxicologists. Not chemists, not biologists, not formulators, but Toxicologists.  You can find the consensus of their opinion about ingredients at https://cir-safety.org 

Ecocert / Cosmos is not a scientific organization. They  are a moneymaking operation that relies on fees from companies who want to get certified using their seal. Their standards are mostly arbitrary and not based on science. 

Thank you for the link!  Just hope that they also are not moneymakers :#
Very dissapointed with Ecocert and Cosmos…

P.S. Sorry for late answer

[Eugene]

Perry said:

I recommend you use parabens and formaldehyde donors. 

I recommend formulators use preservatives that have a long history of safe and effective use (like parabens & formaldehyde donors).

I recommend formulators not use unproven, natural preservatives that likely make products less safe. (like many of the ones approved by Ecocert)

I recommend that formulators do not compromise on product safety and succumb to marketing whims & misinformed consumer desires. 

I recommend you do not follow the formulating strategies of organic companies who produce products that are less safe for consumers.

I’m a bit of a traditionalist when it comes to product safety. I don’t think it should every be compromised in an effort to support a marketing position.  There are other formulators on this forum who have a different philosophy and may provide you with more helpful advice when it comes to the area of natural product preservation. 

I understand you… But it is so hard for a new formulator to choose between safe and safe…When I listen to chemists I get one info, the other side I read scientists works about parabens and formaldehydes that affect hormones and got confused. 
How do they approve those Ecocert/Cosmos preservatives without good testing?

Pharma said:

Weleda does strict tests and I’d say consumers are safe when using their products but honestly, these feel greasy or otherwise unpleasant more often than not. Can’t have it all…

BTW they also use (though not everywhere) glycerol, low pH (citric or lactic acid), w/o emulsions, and in newer concepts also glyceryl caprylate as preservative strategies.

Use the search function, we’ve covered % of alcohol and glycerol on several occasions.

I thought that glyceryl caprylate was only co-emulsifier… Anyway all this components sound like all natural…So they do not break the philosophy of nature formulation.
Thank you! I will search for other  posts on alcohol.

[Eugene]

Perry said:

Sure, Niacinamide is soluble in water.  As to the % to use, that depends on  why you are using it.  Why are you adding it to the formula?

What benefit is it going to bring to the formula that the formula lacks?  

You’ve already got aloe, lavender, cucumber, panthenol, allantoin, hyaulronic acid,  glycerin & a fruit acid complex with 5 more extracts as “active” ingredients. What extra benefit would you get by adding niacinamide?  For that matter, what specific benefit are you getting from each of the things that you have already added?

Whenever you are formulating, each chemical you add to the formula should have some specific purpose. Your goal should be to minimize the number of chemicals you put in a formula, not maximize them. 

If you were cooking, you wouldn’t add a little bit of every single spice in your spice cabinet.  It’s the same with formulating. Add only things to your formula that will provide some specific benefit that you can’t get otherwise.

If you are just adding the Niacinamide for marketing purposes, put in 0.1%.

Thank you for answer. Serum is called Moisture Boost. It has to deeply moisturize dehydrated skin and have calming effect on it. So the the main purpose of so many extracts and moisturizing actives was to justify it. 

Do you say that there is no need to add multiple extracts and actives and only one can do all job? But besides moisture properties, doesn’t these components have other benefit on skin?

What about Niacinamide, I want to add pore minimizing effect to the serum…

[Eugene]

Perry said:

While sodium benzoate and potassium sorbate are certified by Ecocert/Cosmos, they are not actually natural. Supplies of those ingredients are synthetically produced.  There are no truly natural preservatives.  The other downside is that these ingredients will also destabilize emulsions.

The preservative you choose will depend on the type of formula you are making. What are you trying to make? Emulsions? Solutions? Gels?

But as far as Cosmos certified…these are your options:

Benzoic acid and its salts
Benzyl alcohol

Salicylic acid and its salts

Sorbic acid/potassium sorbate

Sodium benzoate

Potassium sorbate

Phenethyl alcohol

Sodium levulinate

Benzoic acid

Ethyl lactate

Whether they are effective or not…well you’ll have to try it and find out. These things are not as reliable as standard, time tested, effective preservatives.

Thank you very much. I’m making emulsions and water based serum. 
It is a very long list but which you can recommend? Will it be effective to use only one of them or should I use the combination?

P.S. Weleda and some of other organic companies use alcohol(raw grain) as a preservative. I tried to find any formula to see proportions but there is no information on websites…

[Eugene]

LincsChemist said:

I like sodium benzoate and potassium sorbate (around 0.4% and 0.2% respectively) - downside is you have to ensure a low pH (4.5-5)

Thank you! Do you use Euxyl® K 712? Or do you mix them by yourself?
Does it has any scent?

[Eugene]

Hi, I’m Eugene from Georgia, Tbilisi. 
I started my small business in soap making 3 years ego. I’ve added some simple cosmetic products to my range also, but I realized that I need some chemistry background to make more complicated products. I found so much info on this forum! Thank you