[Abdullah]

Graillotion said:

100% NOT pure essential oil.

What was it advertised as?  When I see the words ….lavender essential oils….plural….leads me to believe this is promoted as some mix…with some EO’s in it.

Looks like a liter?  How much did that cost you?  In the US…a liter like that, from a top notch seller would cost about US $90.

This was around $15/kg. 
We regularly purchase from India at around $25/kg. Very satisfying quality. 
I haven’t compared it to the one from US.

[Abdullah]

@Graillotion do they add their color to final product too if used @ ≤0.5% noticably?

[Abdullah]

First of all, have you used this product? Did you like it? 
Use if for about a month and see if it can clean your hair enough.

Second, you cant thicken this much decyl Glucoside and glycerin. 

[Abdullah]

For fungi you can use 0.05% Piroctone Olamine. 

Can be solubilized in phenoxyethanol. 

[Abdullah]

@jamesmiju it as emulsion as @Bill_Toge said. 

I did asked them how they are producing it. At first they said it is a secret and didn’t want to tell, but when finally they said this much that at finall stage when essential oil and hydrosol are separated we do a trick and can’t tell the details of it because it is our business secret. When i asked them what is the benefit of it?  they said it reduces the cost of essential oil.

It also combines easily with water. 

[Abdullah]

In addition to what @ozgirl asked, 
What mixer do you use? 
What are the size of your samll and large batch? 
What is the method? Phase A, B, C then mix or everything in one phase?
For how long do you mix small and large batch? 

[Abdullah]

@PhilGeis i think it is good. 
I make shampoo in 200kg tank each time.
I wash the tank properly after emptying the tank and before using it again. 
When not in use, the tank is in the same room with raw materials, completely dry. During use we shift it to another room.
All other equipments are cleaned, used and stored like this.
I haven’t used alcohol to clean the tank or other equipments yet.

[Abdullah]

@PhilGeis thanks 
What do you mean by “What is your making risk”?

[Abdullah]

@PhilGeis it is 
SLS/SLES/CAPB/APG @3/7/2/2 active surfactants.
Cationic guar 0.2%
Amodimethicone emulsion 2.5%(0.75% silicone)
Guar gum 0.1%
EO 0.5%
Citric acid 
Water 
pH 5.1

The bottle is HDPE but i want to change to PET to reduce the cost.
 with flip top cap.
Sizes 200ml and 500ml.

[Abdullah]

PhilGeis said:

Caprylhydroxamic acid is not that good as a chelator in preservative context.

Yeah but if if he want at least some chelating agent in cationic system this is the way ????

[Abdullah]

I don’t like too much butter. 1% may be enough. Coconut oil is good. I would add some petrolatum or dimethicone to it. 
For viscosity these emulsifiers are better. 

[Abdullah]

For me only 6% shea butter is more than what i want on my skin. How do you guys like such high amount of oil face?

[Abdullah]

@Paprik you can use caprylhydroxamic acid with cationics if you want. 

By the way, what not use chelating agent with w/o? 

[Abdullah]

As @Paprik said you need anti fungal. Also you can reduce the amount of dmdm by half. 

Your oil phase is small so the viscosity will not be high woth these emulsifiers. 

[Abdullah]

@Microformulation yeah more effective i mean. 

[Abdullah]

@Paprik thanks

[Abdullah]

@PhilGeis yes it is anti dandruff leave in low viscosity hair lotion. 

[Abdullah]

@Pharma @PhilGeis yeah everything depends on whole formula and also this preservative is not very strong for fungi. But if we use this at 1% in shampoo which one of these two will be stronger? 
Shampoo is SLS/SLES/CAPB/APG at 3/7/2/2 active surfactant

[Abdullah]

My product has phenoxyethanol, caprylhydroxamic acid, Piroctone Olamine and HCl. pH is 4.1 and cationic. And yes it works well. 

I dont like benzyl alcohol, phenoxyethanol is milder that that.
Also caprylhydroxamic acid should be heated, in clod process system it remains undissolved. 

[Abdullah]

Add 2% glyceryl stearate or glyceryl oleate. This also help with soaping.

[Abdullah]

@Pharma very good explanation. 

Can you please explain this part a bit more.
“f it’s unmatched to one side, it doesn’t mean too much. If it’s unmatched to the other side it only means that maybe/probably the emulsion is inversed or if not, potentially unstable.” 

[Abdullah]

You need to mix them then heat it until caprylhydroxamic acid is melted and dissolved and cool it and store it for later use. 
Or you can use them in these percentages directly in your product. I use caprylhydroxamic acid first ingredient in one of my lotions which is cationic and i can’t use chelating agents to chelate iron

[Abdullah]

@Paprik thanks

[Abdullah]

@Paprik yes it has self foaming pump. 

Good point about NACL in surfactants.i should search if these other surfactants also have NACL.

If it has 1% CAPB then it will have around 0.17% NACL. 

My point about evaporation was about essence and phenoxyethanol. Essential oils evaporate when heated. Does fragrance oils evaporate too? 
It has very strong smell. Maybe it has 0.5-1% essence.

Does phenoxyethanol evaporate too because it is a bit volatile?

[Abdullah]

@ngarayeva001 so it will be pretty hard to preserve and also not so gentle because of high pH.