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Thickening without Polymers
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U used both aculyn22 and carbopol in furmula?
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so I omitt aculyn 88 and use only carbomer?
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Just use either of the 2, I would prefer carbopol though. But dont forget to try the aculyn as well.
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I think carbomer and carbopol are as the same.
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I mean use this Carbopol Aqua SF 1 which is Acrylates Copolymer but Carbopol 940/941/980/981 etc are carbomers if you check the INCI description. But basically with polyacrylic acid backbone.
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ok.
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What have work best in your experience for Thickening Decyl Glucosides as well as providing Clarity?
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1) Potassium Oleate or Sodium Oleate
2)CAPB and salt -
@Bobzchemist both or either of the options???
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@Bob, What US manufactures carry Sodium/Potassium Oleate?
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Much cheaper to make it in-situ. Sodium and/or Potassium Hydroxide + Oleic Acid.
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@Bobzchemist that means I can get rid of my thickening polymer to build the viscosity say in a sulfate free preparation and if I need suspension properties then I would require an yield value. And for that I would need a polymer, am I correct in my assessment?
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Using enough oleic acid soap will thicken sulfate-free surfactants. Polymer is not needed, but may be used as an adjunct since too much soap and you will get viscosity build/gelling over time. The soap also has very little suspending power.
It is critical to use a reasonably pure grade of oleic acid, or you will lose clarity. Even high-oleic sunflower oil, at 90% oleic, has enough non-oleic constituents to cloud up/opacify your product. -
@chem decyl glocoside isnt a very good tichening agent
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Thanks Bob for the clarification….From what I understand is I create a Saponification using Oleic Acid and NaOH and then add Decyl Glucoside? Kindly correct if I am understanding wrong here.
@ Nasrin, I am aware of it…what we trying to learn here is how to thicken a Cleanser using Decyl Glucoside as a surfactact.
Thanks
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@nasrins - there are a number of different Carbomer grades so they are not all the same. See Lubrizol’s website for different grades and when you would use them. The Carbopol Aqua SF-1 should work for what you are trying to do.
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@Perry I have used SF 1 and it has worked out perfect, only downside is a little initial slimy feel when you take the product in hands and start putting it in hair. But after that it is perfect foaming and it has suspended my pearl particles too, Aculyn 22 failed me on suspension. As we all know sulfate free recipes are a tad too difficult to thicken compared to sulfate based which are generally a cakewalk in most of the cases.
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@ChemWizard, you are exactly correct. Saponified Oleic Acid is a very thick gel, though, so you have to figure out how to incorporate it into Decyl Glucoside without foaming - it’s doable, but not easy, especially at a production scale.
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@Bobzchemist wow this gives me a clear idea about my Moroccan Bath Soap as well. Though it is quite stiff as well, just trying to figure which polymer would provide such stiffness, cellulosic or something else.
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@bobz would u expain it again. the best way to thickening your batch with decy glocoside surfactant and having enough suspending.
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