How to mix all this

nijamnijam Member
edited December 2014 in Formulating
hi guys. i'm not a chemist but want to ask,how to mix all this ingredients? can someone explain in a simple ways ? what temperature is needed to heat this.
WATER (AQUA)  
CETEARETH-25  
GLYCERIN  
PEG-7 GLYCERYL COCOATE  
PEG 40 HYDROGENTATED CASTOR OIL  
PVP K90  
PROPYLENE GLYCOL  
SIMETHICONE  
DMDM HYDANTOIN  
FRAGRANCE (PARFUM)  
PEG-8 BEESWAX  
POLYSORBATE 20  

this is formula for w/s pomade that i got from this forum too. thanks in advance 

Comments

  • BobzchemistBobzchemist Member, PCF student
    Don't do it. This is not a place for beginners.
    Robert Zonis, Sr. Formulation Chemist, Beaumont Products "All opinions and comments expressed are my own, have no relation to Beaumont Products, are fully copyrighted, and may not be used without written permission."
  • @Bobzchemist
    i have some basic knowledge in chemist.. sorry for asking,why i cannot do this?
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    This is a pretty standard formula but you should have the right equipment (beakers, hot plate and mixer).
    Assuming you have that you have to mix all the water based ingredients in one phase and the oil based ingredients in the other.

    Heat to 75C, blend water and oil phases, mix at least 20 minutes.  Cool down and when the batch is below 45C, add DMDM Hydantoin and fragrance.

    But Bob is right, you should have a working knowledge of all the ingredients you are using before making the formula.

    Perry, 44


  • lubrizol,making cosmetic and many other reputed companies introduce furmulas with procedure

    https://www.lubrizol.com/PersonalCare/Formulations/SkinCareBodyLotions.html

    http://www.makingcosmetics.com/Formulas_ep_5.html

     

  • @Perry
    thanks.clear explanation from you. thanks again.

    @nasrins
    thanks for the link.will discovered it soon !
  • how to divide the ingredient into phase A and phase B ?
  • CosChemFanCosChemFan Member
    edited March 2015
    Isn't this Bonafide Hair Pomade? If you're a home crafter good luck finding one or two of those ingredients on that list. They aren't available in small quantities unfortunately. If I had to guess the formulation would look like this:

    Phase A
    WATER
    CETEARETH-25 MakingCosmetics.com
    GLYCERIN (Any vender)  
    PEG-7 GLYCERYL COCOATE (TheHerbarie.com and MakingCosmetics.Com)
    PEG 40 HYDROGENTATED CASTOR OIL (Makingcosmetics.com)
    SIMETHICONE (Not sure where to get this)
    PEG-8 BEESWAX (Not Sure)

    Phase B
    Water
    PVP K90 (makingcosmetics)
    PROPYLENE GLYCOL (Anywhere)

    Phase C 
    DMDM HYDANTOIN (personalformulator)
    POLYSORBATE 20 (Anywhere) 
    FRAGRANCE (PARFUM)  

    That would be my guess. :-??
  • can i use normal beeswax rather than PEG-8 Beeswax and normal castor oil ? 
  • You could, but the product would be entirely different and may not even work.
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • BobzchemistBobzchemist Member, PCF student
    My best guess is that using unmodified ("normal") beeswax and castor oil would completely destroy the formula - but you "can" use anything you want to use - we're not stopping you. 
    Robert Zonis, Sr. Formulation Chemist, Beaumont Products "All opinions and comments expressed are my own, have no relation to Beaumont Products, are fully copyrighted, and may not be used without written permission."
  • @shahimanshair This is a water based product so adding the non-ethoxlyated versions of those ingredients would be kind of counterproductive and pointless. The point of using the PEG-8 Beeswax is to make the formula water soluble so it washes out a heck of a lot easier, but still give that waxy hold and finish. Normal beeswax, 1) wouldn't give you that easy wash out and 2) more than likely would give a really ugly feel to the product (if it formed anything at all) since the other ingredients wouldn't really combine with it. Not to mention water and waxes don't mix very well. Regular castor oil is not even close to PEG-40 HCO. Two completely different ingredients. PEG-40 HCO is a surfactant, solubilizer,and can emulsify things if you really need it to. It doesn't have moisturizing or conditioning properties, but it's water soluble.
    ****
    You might want to obtain a better understanding of your ingredients and some basic chemistry to help you put this together. :) This seems like a pretty difficult formula. I'm still new to all this myself with only about 7-8 months of experience actually working with the raw materials. Before that it was all research and being mentored. You REALLY have to just experiment after getting the basics down. Hope this helps!

    Regards,
    CosChemFan
  • The comments above are all 100% right on the button. You see, until you have experimented with each of these ingredients, you have no idea of their properties either individually or in combination. 

    Taking someone's LOI and trying to duplicate the product is really not easy despite what some may say, and that's assuming a full understanding of the properties of each ingredient.

    It is in my opinion much easier to design with a bottom-up approach. Then every time you add an ingredient it is easy to ascertain the effect of it. If you try to duplicate a product, it then becomes a game of (eg) "Why isn't this thick enough? Do I need to add more of x? More of y? Or less of z?

    I once tried to duplicate a body wash/hair shampoo product. It had an LOI about 30 ingredients long. I failed completely. Then I realised I should be designing my own. How on earth would I ever learn to design NEW products if I spent my time copying other people? I set to work and designed a body wash product that worked at least as well as the one I had been trying to copy, and it had nine ingredients instead of dozens.

    In few words: You need to be prepared to invest a few hundred dollars in a range of standard materials, another few hundred in basic tools, and a LOT of time, and then, IF you have the talent for it - you may become a cosmetic product designer.
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • thank you for the information guys. i really appreciate it 
  • I think @Belassi captured what almost ever cosmetic designer will tell you here:

    "I once tried to duplicate a body wash/hair shampoo product. It had an LOI about 30 ingredients long. I failed completely. Then I realised I should be designing my own. How on earth would I ever learn to design NEW products if I spent my time copying other people? I set to work and designed a body wash product that worked at least as well as the one I had been trying to copy, and it had nine ingredients instead of dozens."
  • @Braveheart very very true. That's how I started.
  • Croyez MOI JE ME SUIS Penché sur la réalisation de projet CE pendants 12 mois
    pouqu'en fin j'ai obtenu un résultat.
    La chose que je te veux Comprendre cest Pourquoi compliquéz vous cette formule
    enlevez le PEG-8 , LA SIMETHICONE ET LE PVP ET CA IRA BIEN
  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    @charmer is it possible for you to comment in English so that everyone can be benefitted from your comments
  • What the differences  between  refined  and unrefined  beewax? 
  • @Sherman_01 you need to start a new thread.
    But basically, unrefined beeswax just lies about the lab all day in a vulgar sort of way. . . 
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • I use regular beeswax for my pomades and they come out fine.  It's all entirely up to you.  Just mix away.  It's not like you will make the lab explode.  
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