Looking for a Retinol Expert to write an opinion regarding stabilization

Hello,

I'm looking for a retinol expert with chemist credentials to write an opinion regarding the lack of retinol stabilizing ingredients in a few retinol products currently on the market.  This is a paid job of course and there is potential for further related projects. 

Thanks 

Comments

  • PharmaPharma Member, Pharmacist
    Just to understand you correctly:
    You're looking for a retinol expert (= a beauty expert, dermatologist, or plastic surgeon) who studied chemistry (not cosmetic chemistry but real chemistry) who writes an article on some commercial retinol products which do not contain ingredients to protect retinol from degradation (and wherein only a clairvoyant knows wheter or not and if, how badly, retinol actually degrades)... WTF!
    What you need is a psychologist to explain why some people give a s#|+ whether or not their cosmetic ingredients degrade, a layer who explains why said people don't have to because they can't be sued neither for negligence nor ignorance, and a marketing person to elaborate on how easy it is to sell dirt for gold ;) .
  • YulinYulin Member
    Pharma said:
    Just to understand you correctly:
    You're looking for a retinol expert (= a beauty expert, dermatologist, or plastic surgeon) who studied chemistry (not cosmetic chemistry but real chemistry) who writes an article on some commercial retinol products which do not contain ingredients to protect retinol from degradation (and wherein only a clairvoyant knows wheter or not and if, how badly, retinol actually degrades)... WTF!
    What you need is a psychologist to explain why some people give a s#|+ whether or not their cosmetic ingredients degrade, a layer who explains why said people don't have to because they can't be sued neither for negligence nor ignorance, and a marketing person to elaborate on how easy it is to sell dirt for gold ;) .
    Thanks for your opinion.  Sorry if you are having a bad day.  There are a few ways to stabilize retinol that I think most retinol experts are aware of what they are.  We have verified that they work in our product line after doing intermittent testing over the past few years.  We just need someone with expert credentials and retinol experience to write an opinion. 

    Sounds like you are referring just to US law in regards to the legal aspect - but actually outside of the US many countries have much stronger consumer protection and competition laws that make it very easy to sue for damages if you either purchased a product that does not contain what it says it does or if you are competing in the marketplace against a product that does not contain what it says it does.  Also the losing side usually has to pay the legal fees and damages for testing fees and personal time spent on the case so there isn't any downside to pursuing legal action.  
  • PharmaPharma Member, Pharmacist
    I had a gread day, I know that retinol can be what you call 'stabilitzed' (turns out that your initial post is misleading because you've been asking for 'to write an opinion regarding the lack of retinol stabilizing ingredients'), and I'm not US based ;) .
    You're referring to cosmetics, not drugs and (probably with the exception of Japan where some products are quasi-drugs) hence, degradation isn't an issue as long as the degradation product doesn't do any harm (which is unknown but assumed non-problematic due to a don't care mentality in case of retinol).
    Accountability is in the hands of the manufacturer and, quite seriously, most don't care too much because they know that it's virtually impossible to prove that a degradation product of a cosmetic ingredient caused harm (humanity usually learns the hard way some decades of 'don't worry, this is absolutely safe' later).
    You're quite the cosmetics person because you ask a chemist for an opinion instead of using facts and publishing your data showing how it's done (or how not to do it).
  • YulinYulin Member
    I'm not writing here how it's done because then someone can claim they're an expert and just quote what I wrote when I go through the vetting process.  I'm sure there are some retinol experts here who know what I am referring to in regards to the available methods of stabilizing retinol and those are the people I am seeking to correspond with.  I already know what the methods are and the only way I can test their knowledge is to verify that they know the methods too so I don't want to give it away. 

    In regards to the legal aspect please stop commenting on that because you don't know what you are talking about.  You don't know the laws of every single country on this planet and they are widely varying in regards to issues like this so you can't possibly make wide sweeping declarations like you keep doing.   
  • PharmaPharma Member, Pharmacist
    Eh? If you could explain how it's done in such a good way that you would pass as expert before your own eyes, why don't you yourself write the article?
    Retinol is a chemical compound and hence, you don't necessarily have to be a retinol specialist but rather a pharmacist or chemist to know from common knowledge what it takes.
    No, I don't know the cosmetic laws of every single country but I know some (of the better regulated one) and I know the difference between cosmetics and pharmaceuticals: The latter have regulations regarding stability and degradation.
    As long as this is an open public forum, I'm commenting on whatever I'd like to comment.
    Or do you simply need someone with intimidating enough credentials so nobody will double check when he/she puts his/her name under your opinion so you can discredit competition in order to boost sales of your own product? That's an honest question for an honest ansewr, not an offense or an insult (I have the impression you do feel that I'm doing exactly that but I'm not).
  • GraillotionGraillotion Member
    edited June 17
    I doubt you will find much luck in what you are looking for on this site, as you have mistakenly tangled with one of the most brilliant PhD's you'll ever come across (a true PhD among PhD's).  Sometimes the ignorant mistakes brilliance for something else.

    Good Luck.
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