Chelating agents and pigment/mica

Can you use chelators like disodium EDTA and sodium phytate together with pigments/mica?
The mica that I have contains Fe, Sn and Ti (di)oxides. I'm not sure how it is coated.

Comments

  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    @Doreen I have a similar issue here, difference being instead of those pigments I have Zinc Pyrithione and if the chelant will interfere with  ‎Zn+2
  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    @Bill_Toge
    @DRBOB@VERDIENT.BIZ

    Any insights here???
  • Bill_TogeBill_Toge Member, Professional Chemist
    @Doreen never had a problem them; chelators only affect dissolved metal ions, and the metal oxides in question are a) insoluble and b) coated onto the mica, making them particularly difficult to dissolve even if they were soluble

    @Chemist77 similarly, zinc pyrithione is insoluble in water, so there are no (or nearly no) zinc ions present

    trivia time: the first discovered fungicide of this kind was sodium pyrithione, but it proved to be toxic to the point of impracticality due to its high solubility in water, which is why the zinc salt is used instead
    UK based formulation chemist. Strongest subjects: hair styling, hair bleaches, hair dyes (oxidative and non-oxidative) I know some stuff about: EU regulations, emulsions (O/W and W/O), toothpaste, mouthwash, shampoos, other toiletries
  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    @Bill_Toge thank you so much, I knew I would have the reply before sunset ??
    And that’s why I have 48% dispersion and not a solution. And that’s why it needs to be homogenized to reduce the particle size for suspension.
    Thank you again for that trivia. 
  • @Bill_Toge
    Thank you very much! :+1:
  • Along these lines, does this mean zinc pca and phytic acid don't belong in the same formula?
  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    Going by what @Bill_Toge mentioned, the solubility will be an important factor then. 
  • Bill_TogeBill_Toge Member, Professional Chemist
    edited April 2018
    @EliseCortes zinc forms a coordination complex with PCA; whether or not it will precipitate if phytic acid is present depends whether or not the complex with phytic acid is more stable than the complex with PCA, a question which I don't personally know the answer to, and will most likely have to be answered by experiment
    UK based formulation chemist. Strongest subjects: hair styling, hair bleaches, hair dyes (oxidative and non-oxidative) I know some stuff about: EU regulations, emulsions (O/W and W/O), toothpaste, mouthwash, shampoos, other toiletries
  • Sorry but just saw the above questions.Agree with Bill Toge—.On Zn PCA/PHYTIC Acid question, phytic Acid plays essential role by limiting/inhibiting uptake on Zn,Cu and Fe in the body via complex formation and looking at PA structure speculation suggests that via Phosphate ester groups the latter likely forms most stable Zn complex.I have no data to support that but why use both unless you want to experiment.?
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