Conditioner without Quat

Hello! I live in Northern California, and I recently noticed a new trend. Refill bars for shampoo, conditioner, lotion..etc They are trying to save the planet from plastic accumulation and other toxic chemicals.
To my surprise the bulk conditioners they offered did not contain any Quats.

Griffin Remedy Daily Conditioner.
Ingredients: purified water, certified Organic aloe vera gel, coconut fatty acid cream base, guar gum, vitamin B complex, sea buckthorn fruit oil, shea butter, vitamin E, orange essential oil, rosemary extract, sage extract, horsetail extract, castor oil, willow bark extract, saw palmetto extract, sunflower oil, carica papaya extract, soy protein, coconut glycerin, MSM, certified Organic jojoba oil, sodium levulinate, peppermint essential oil

Oneka Unscented Conditioner
Purified water, Organic blend of Calendula officinalis (Calendula), Arctium lappa (Burdock root), Salvia officinalis (Sage), Urtica dioica (Nettle leaves), Rosmarinus officinalis (Rosemary), Taraxacum officinale (Dandelion), Equisetum arvense (Horsetail), Angelica archangelica (Angelica), Hydrastis Canadensis (Goldenseal), Simmondsia Chinensis (Jojoba Oil), Cannabis Sativa (Hemp seed oil), Tocopheryl Acetate (Vitamin E), Oryza sativa (Rice Protein), Panthenol (Vitamin B5), Cetyl alcohol (plant-derived), Polyglyceryl-2 di polyhydroxy stearate, Caprylyl Glycol, Ethylhexylglycerin


To my surprise they work really well, as well as a conditioner with BTMS.
Can you really make a conditioner without a quat? I did not think so.

Thanks,

Syl

Comments

  • chemicalmattchemicalmatt Member, Professional Chemist
    @Syl, you certainly can, although I love my quats!. Applying oils to the hair after cleansing is one of the oldest personal care applications in history, going back to the ancient Greeks and Persians. There is some panthenol and protein involved also - both adsorb onto and into hair. I also spy several herbals here long admired for haircare exclusively, for reasons I don't have any knowledge to base that on: horsetail, nettle, burdock, sage, sea buckthorn, salvia. Then, for comic relief, they have "coconut glycerin" included: as if you could tell. (and...there goes the rain forest.)

  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    The other thing to keep in mind. This is a company that does not follow INCI labeling rules. "Purified water", "organic blend..." are not terms that are allowed on an INCI list. 

    So, they could easily be adding a cationic and just not listing it.
  • SylSyl Member
    Is not using INCI legal? The Griffin Remedy brand is very popular here, they are sold at Whole Foods in my area. I agree with you Perry, I think they are not listing the cationic ingredients. Unfortunately, the alternative of applying oils to hair is not very attractive. I am sticking with cationic surfactants and giving up on trying to make a comparable conditioner. Thank you for your help, you saved me from doing additional experiments.
  • SylSyl Member
    Regarding comic relief; I thought the vitamin B complex, instead of panthenol was very original.
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    Not using proper INCI is illegal, but illegal in the way that speeding is illegal. You can do it until you get caught.  The FDA has a lot going on so improper INCI listings is not high on their list of things to go after aggressively.
  • PattsiPattsi Member
    I don't think they hide the ingredient but I doubt that their products work well.
  • One ingredient is cream base. It means they are hiding. What is inside that cream base?

    Also the name of these herbs, they don't say if they are essential oil, extract, powder, water, color or what.
  • SylSyl Member
    I tried the Griffin Remedy daily conditioner expecting that it would not work and I was shocked. It smelled nice orange essential oil and it performed extremely well, so well I would buy if I did not make my own. I have fine colored wavy hair that frizz easily. It must contain Stearamidopropyl dimethylamine or something similar.
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