• Posted by ehmod1989 on December 14, 2015 at 7:58 pm

    Hi Friends

    I did shampoo with this recipe
    10% texapon 70%
    3% luramide 
    3% betaine 
    1.25% polyquatrnium 10
    1.5% NACL salt 
    2% uberlan 2200
    the foam so good 
    but the problem it did dandruff in hair 
    so what is the material percentage make this problem 
    and what is the solution  
    belassi replied 8 years, 3 months ago 7 Members · 22 Replies
  • 22 Replies
  • bobzchemist

    Member
    December 14, 2015 at 8:22 pm

    I don’t think I can help with this unless you explain with much more detail. The shampoo caused dandruff?

  • ehmod1989

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 11:02 am

    yes it is caused dandruff in hair with Itching in the head 

  • ashish

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 11:31 am

    It may be due to dryness, please use moisturizers.

  • ehmod1989

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 12:44 pm

    like what ? and what it is percentage ? what it is about polyquatarnium 10 ? 

  • bobzchemist

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 2:37 pm

    That’s a very disturbing, possibly dangerous result from a shampoo. The answer, I’m afraid, is for you to hire a professional formulator/chemist to formulate a shampoo for you before you hurt someone seriously. 

  • belassi

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 4:05 pm

    Unfortunately you have not specified in sufficient detail what is in your shampoo. “Texapon”? There are a dozen surfactants called by that name. What type? “Luramide”? Do you mean Lauramide DEA? Or what? “Betaine” - which betaine? And since I can’t find “Uberlan 2200” with Google I can only assume you mis-spelt it.

  • ehmod1989

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 6:38 pm

    10% Sodium Laureth Sulphate (2EO) 

    3% luramide DEA
    3% Cocamidopropyl Betaine
    1.25% polyquatrnium 10
    1.5% NACL salt 
    2% uberlan 2200  — the material that make spangle in shampoo it is make the shampoo color to become white and not transparent —
  • belassi

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 6:51 pm

    Nothing that should cause problems - except, that “uberlan” - Google finds nothing related to that. Please provide a LINK!

  • ehmod1989

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 7:22 pm
    ok
    because luramide made from coconut oil and i am using 3% from it.
      is my percentage make more oil in hair that cause  dandruff ? 
    i am using 100 g olive oil i forgot to write that 
    uberlan it is dye 
  • belassi

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 9:07 pm

    Good grief. I had better tell you now: olive oil causes serious scalp problems. It is well documented.

  • ehmod1989

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 9:28 pm
    do you mean the problem in the using of olive oil?
     olive oil cause dandruff ?

    if it is how can i solve problem of 500 kg of produced shampoo that I have in the tank? 

  • heraklit

    Member
    December 15, 2015 at 10:14 pm

    Web is full of olive oil remedies to treat dry scalp and dandruff. BUT:
    http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1308503

    I put 0.1% olive oil in my shampoo only for label appeal, due to I am living in an olive oil production region.

  • belassi

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 1:45 am

    @ehmod: I hate to tell you this but I have read documents, possibly in pubMed, I can’t recall, you will have to search. What I read, was that oleic acid causes severe damage to the scalp, actually causing the loss of hair in clumps attached to greasy scalp scales. Olive oil is the triglyceride and also causes scalp damage to a somewhat less aggressive degree. Your result appears to confirm this.

    As to how to remove olive oil dissolved in a surfactant? Unsurprisingly this is not something commonly encountered. I honestly don’t know. I would have to begin by simultaneously researching on the Web and also doing small scale experiments. EG if I saturate with sodium chloride can I knockout the surfactancy and force the oil to separate out? But then how do I get rid of the salt? And so on. To be honest I suspect you are faced with disposing safely of that whole batch.
    You know, all this could have been avoided if you had done what Bob suggested, that is to say, consult a professional. I would have told you in a heartbeat not to add olive oil to any hair product.
  • belassi

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 1:49 am

    saturated fatty acids likely encourage Malassezia overgrowth and excess unsaturated fatty acids may induce inflammation and scaling.

    - yes that one. I’ve seen that before. 
  • belassi

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 1:53 am

    Thinking about it, you might be able to use something like TEA to emulsify the oil.

    I still have a nagging doubt. This “dye”, how come I can’t find it using a search engine? You’ve got a mystery material at 2%… what exactly is that and what is the INCI name for it?
  • Kirk

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 3:50 am

    Maybe its a pearlizer? Like ethylene glycol distearate. 

    Well, we could only guess what that Uberlan is.
  • heraklit

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 7:52 am

    In fact, olive oil may worsens the existing dandruff, but does not cause it. Even oleic acid can induce the problem only in dandruff-prone individuals. A comprehensive review:
    http://cmr.asm.org/content/25/1/106.full
    https://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php/Malassezia_and_Human_Skin_Diseases

  • microformulation

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 11:24 am

    Is he referring to Euperlan, the BASF line of pearlizers? I know there is a Euperlan PK 2200 product although I haven’t seen it in years.

  • belassi

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 3:18 pm

    Yes, must be Euperlan. Well spotted! Contains coco glucoside … I have already reported that I believe that coco glucoside may cause allergic reactions. And with the olive oil as well? Not surprised there’s a problem,

  • microformulation

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 3:35 pm

    The Olive oil in shampoos generally isn’t an issue when designed correctly. As we all know, significant levels of oils in a shampoo are not the way to go. Even if any remains after the surfactant is rinsed out, this would lead to very negative aesthetics (greasy hair). That is generally why when the oils are used at a low level for “label claim.” I have heard this question addressed in seminars and the feeling is that with the short period of exposure and limited level of exposure that any negative effect would be greatly blunted. Honestly, I have heard little to no other sources report on significant irritation with the APG’s, but I am certainly keeping an ear out for additional adverse incidents.

  • ehmod1989

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 5:57 pm
    Thank you all
    I am sorry because i didn’t write Euperlan well.
     I used this material I got it from raw material supplier
    Euperlan® PK 771 Benz is a cold-processable, pasty, dispersion of pearlizing agents that is used for dense and particularly brilliant surfactant preparations with a silky shine. It contains fatty alcohol ether sulfate and has a typical faint odor. This product has a dry residue amount of 44-48%, an anionic surfactant (MW 382) of 19-22%, and a pH value (10%) of 3.0-4.0.
     can we use these result 
    - the olive oil cause the problem for scalp because it is contain olic acid and increase dandruff for person who already has dandruff ( This is what happened to me and my father actually )
    - Eupelan react with olive oil and make the problem become more
    - the percentage of material that is used ( SLES & luramide MEA and betaine ) is good specially MEA and not cause any problem i repeat specially luramide MEA because it is built viscosity without need to increase NACL percentage. 

    finally 
    2% of Euperlan is it good percentage without using olive oil i mean in new formula without using olive oil is it cause any problem for scalp ?
    and the using of 1% polyquatarnium is perfect percentage because it is used in ( 0.25 % - 0.5% ) is it cause any problem in 1% percent?
  • belassi

    Member
    December 16, 2015 at 6:33 pm

    I believe if you remove the olive oil from the formula your problem will go away.

    However … 3% Lauramide MEA. I haven’t used this myself but I suspect that as with Cocamide MEA it will move the salt curve to the left and you may find that your 1.5% salt content is too high. You should calibrate the appropriate amount of salt to use by using a series of small test samples from 0.4 to 2% NaCl and see how the viscosity changes.
    Polyquaternium 10 is cationic and I’m doubtful about its compatibility with an anionic system, but others will be better able to comment on that.

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