Stearamidopropyl Dimethylamine and Brassicamidopropyl Dimethylamine

ZaraZara Member
Hi everyone,
I've read Stearamidopropyl Dimethylamine and Brassicamidopropyl Dimethylamine are silicon alternative and also don't give your hair a build up which would be perfect for my super fine hair.
I've tried them too many times in a conditioner formula but they made the conditioner so runny and then separation and a big disappoint. I had 2.5g BTMS25, 3g Cetyl alcohol and 1g oil in the formula + 2g of the above ingredients.

I tried so many different ways of adding them, adding both or one of them, also tried adjusting the water PH before combining them but nothing seems working.

I need to make a very light conditioner with lots of anti-static ingredients for my flying hair which has so much static.
Atm the conditioner I am using has BTMS25 and Cetyl alcohol which it is a bit heavy for my hair. Do you think BTMS50 could be lighter?
Thanks

Comments

  • BTMS50 can't be less conditioning than BTMS-25 because it's twice as concentrated.
  • @Zara Amido amines can't unfortunately replace silicones, since they are small molecules that deposit preferable between hair cuticles or at hydrophilic sites, unlike silicones which can cover large areas. Nevertheless, they can actually improve softness, especially if combined with heavy quaternized surfactants like Behentrimonium chloride. But used alone, I don't think they would be enough to keep your emulsion together. 
  • edited October 2020
    You need to make sure the pH of your waters phase is bout 4.8 - 5.0 before you add the stearamidopropyl dimethylamine.  Also BTMS 25 has cetearyl alcohol attached so it should be a good thickener.  Try increasing that if you want a less runny emulsion.  These ingredients do not replace silicones, but there are more natural alternatives like LexFeel N Series by Inolex.  Dont be afraid of silicones.  They are processed from sand fyi if that makes you feel better about them.  I had to educate myself on this and concluded that I no longer take issue with silicones as long as they are not irritants or toxic.
  • ;ketchito , that is a good point, so if it goes inside the cuticle because of their small molecules they are not able to provide enough slip/glide as well.
     
    Don't you think they can help my fine hair look more voluminous because the molecules can go inside the cuticles or they would washed out because of water solubility?

    creatorhealer2020 As these 2 ingredients are water soluble, do you think I can have better result if I mix them to the neutralized water rather than adding them to the oil phase of the formula which I always do for Behentrimonium Chloride?
    I also searched for LexFeel N and there are quite a few of them, which one do you think is better for my fine hair? Atm I am using Plantsit and Cetiol C5 in my formula.
    Thank you all for your help. :)
  • @Zara I believe that small polymers that don't pack well perform better at giving volume to hair. For instance, silicones bend and twist so well, they spread better and form a more even film than cationic guar of same molecular weight, so cationic guar might give a better performance on conferring volume to hair. This is of course roughly speaking.
  • For alkyl dimetylamine you need to neutralized first with lactic or citric acid
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