Colloidal silver or silver ion water?

Is it true that colloidal silver (often dark colored water) is full of silver particels, but silver ion water is water without silver particles but still have gone threw a similar prosess? I like to use silver ion water to a shaving soap, but do not want nano silver particles.

Comments

  • PharmaPharma Member, Pharmacist
    Well, standard colloidal silver water is unfortunately (or should I say fortunately?) always "contaminated" with silver ions. "Fortunately" because the antimicrobial activity is due to silver ions rather than silver metal particles.
    If you want only the ions without metallic silver present, use a soluble silver salt such as silver nitrate. Mind, it's highly susceptible to light and also oxygen and will turn into dark useless silver oxide.
    What do you expect from your formula (apart from being the best possible shaving soap ever :smile: )? Silver quite often doesn't do sh** and certainly not the magic the whole hype is all about. It will also react with different ingredients and hence put you on a short leash regarding formula flexibility.
  • I was sure silver ions is good for the skin - like treating acne and sore skin. So that is not true then? If I add 10% of the water phrase as silver iones ( and 90% water) - could that be effective as acne treatment? (I make my own silver water using a battery and pure silver rods.
  • PharmaPharma Member, Pharmacist
    tinas said:
    I was sure silver ions is good for the skin - like treating acne and sore skin. So that is not true then? If I add 10% of the water phrase as silver iones ( and 90% water) - could that be effective as acne treatment? (I make my own silver water using a battery and pure silver rods.
    A battery... what you get with that is a mixture of colloidal silver, silver ions and silver salt (if it works: a grey to dark colour tells you that it does).
    For killing bacteria (and that's about all silver does, except for potentially harmful stuff related to it being a heavy metal), all it takes are 10-20 ppm, probably less.
    Could it be effective? According to FB and the like, silver is an organic, all natural antibiotic and miracle substance which imbues the user with magical powers and eternal life. Science says that it kills bacteria on contact (because it's a heavy metal which reacts with proteins). In most applications, silver is inactivated by proteins.
  • ok, thank you!!

  • I am sure many heard about this magical product:

    https://www.laprairie.co.uk/gb/cellular-cream/95790-00152-24.html?ncr=true&gclid=CjwKCAjwqZPrBRBnEiwAmNJsNiUcetNvsSuROGW4-SYZFoAD4ZGGnrbYqZeY0na6t4vOOcJkT-CDaxoC-qIQAvD_BwE

    A very basic O/W emulsion made with rather cheap esters, emulsified with some seppic's polymer (Either Sepinov EMT 10 or Simulgel NS). Generally speaking nothing special, but look what that pinch of silver and platinum (bold) did to the price tag :wink:

    Water, Butylene Glycol, C12-20 Acid PEG-8 Ester, Glycerin, Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride, Squalane, Coco-Caprylate/Caprate, Myristyl Myristate, C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate, Hydroxyethyl Acrylate/Sodium Acryloyldimethyl Taurate Copolymer, Mica, Potassium Cetyl Phosphate, Caprylyl Glycol, Tribehenin, Carbomer, Alcohol, Chondrus Crispus (Carrageenan), Hexylene Glycol, Polysorbate 60, Lecithin, Disodium EDTA, Sodium Hydroxide, Glycoproteins, Hesperidin, Glyceryl Acrylate/Acrylic Acid Copolymer, Ceramide 2, Carnosine, Sodium Hyaluronate, Polygonum Cuspidatum Root Extract, Biosaccharide Gum-1, PEG-8, Lactic Acid, Poloxamer 188, Panax Ginseng Root Extract, Tocopherol, Equisetum Arvense (Horsetail) Extract, Hematite Extract, Malachite Extract, Palmitoyl Oligopeptide, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Silybum Marianum Fruit Extract, Citric Acid, Ascorbic Acid, Polysorbate 80, Platinum Powder, Silver Oxide, Fragrance, Benzyl Alcohol, Linalool, Hydroxycitronellal, Alpha-Isomethyl Ionone, Amyl Cinnamal, Hexyl Cinnamal, Evernia Furfuracea (Treemoss) Extract, Geraniol, Benzyl Benzoate, Butylphenyl Methylpropional, Phenoxyethanol, Titanium Dioxide, Iron Oxides


  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    There are much better ingredients to use instead of silver for pretty much any personal care application.  For example, silver is not an FDA approved treatment for acne.
  • Silver nitrate in higher concentrations leaves a lovely grey-brown stain on the skin, so even though it's soluble I would be careful  leaving it on the body too long. 
  • DoreenDoreen Member
    edited August 2019
    @ngarayeva001
    (...) Generally speaking nothing special, but look what that pinch of silver and platinum (bold) did to the price tag (...)
    I think the figure on that price tag is only caused by that stupid brandname. What is it with you and these insanely expensive brands? :lol:

    Good that you mention the danger of 'colloidal silver' ingestion, @Perry.
    I know someone who drinks this stuff and describes all kinds of magical effects to it (I wonder when her skin will start looking like this). Ironically, she's extremely chemophobic.
  • @Doreen, you are right I am obsessed with expensive skincare :smiley: The reason for that is the aesthetics. These brands have to justify the price tag and they really invest in the aesthetics of the product. Something that is being sold for £200+ can't feel like veg oil with polawax and stearic acid. I reverse engineer these products to learn the trick of creating "the texture" :)
    To be honest, "the secret" boils down to the right combination of polymeric emulsifiers, esters with different polarities (polar and medium in one product), (and petrolatum in many cases) and often silicone elastomers.
    By the way I had a sample (I am not that crazy to buy it lol) of that platinum monster (by the way it has weird greish-bluish color not typical for skincare). It's meh. La Prairie have products with much better texture.
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    Doreen said:

    Good that you mention the danger of 'colloidal silver' ingestion, @Perry.
    I know someone who drinks this stuff and describes all kinds of magical effects to it (I wonder when her skin will start looking like this). 
    Now that is funny s*it, Doreen.  The caption should read "the rare medical term for this blue skin pigment condition is Stupidity"
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    One thing the world will never find lacking is a shortage of idiots ... LOL!  
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
  • One thing the world will never find lacking is a shortage of idiots ... LOL!  
    Too true.
    Not to sound cliché, but she's also anti-vaxx.
    Glad I got rid of my Facebook account. With that one click there go all the 'out-of-courtesy-accepted-friendship requests-from-far away-relatives'. (in this case far away genetically (phew!) and in distance) :relieved:
  • Drinks silver water and an antivaxer. Unpopular opinion but I think this is the moment when government should intervene in the interest of children such people have.. and I am totally against large government. I hope she doesn’t insist on her family members drinking silver water..
  • @ngarayeva001
    I think she did, they even travel the world with it

    Kidding aside, you're right, I hope so too. Point with people like her is they can't be reasoned with. They stubbornly believe fake internet 'doctors' and all kinds of bullsh*t sites rather than consulting credible sources. They know it better than academically trained professionals because they have done 'extensive research', which seems to be the equivalent of using Google and reading some stuff here and there.
    The refusal to use their common sense (if they even have it), oftentimes even up to the point of conspiracy theories, 'Big Pharma', chemtrails etc.
    The weird thing is, my far away relative wasn't always as distrustful and downright stupid as she is now.
    Like a well functioning computer that somewhere along the line went totally haywire and started rejecting its anti-virus software.
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    When I was a kid, we all lined up in the gymnasium and a local physician and nurse would come by for the day and everyone would get vaccinated at the same time.  There was never any question about it ... private catholic school so there was no saying "No" ...

    And, fast forward to where all these idiot celebrities (most of whom have probably been vaccinated, btw) popping off their anti-vaxx nonsense and putting other people and their children in danger.  It's like going back to the middle ages.

    Doreen, lots of people go wacky-woo-woo reading that conspiracy nonsense on the internet.
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    Meanwhile, said celebrities have no problems injecting Botox (one of the most toxic substances known) into their face.
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    And while we're at it ... all these pathetic self-indulgent people all worried about their gender identities ... Seriously, dress however you want to, have sex with whomever you want to and grow up.  What I find most objectionable is that "They" have assimilated chemical terms into their lexicon ... "I'm a cis-gender male pansexual" ... SMH 
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
  • ngarayeva001ngarayeva001 Member
    edited August 2019
    Haha Mark, your comments remind me unpopular opinion subreddit. And I am on the same page with you. Vaccinate your kids, don’t drink colloidal silver and don’t try to cure serious disease with bloody essential oils. Unfortunately I have an antivaxer relative (not so far) too. At least she’s not trying to impose it on others.
    So, these are actually chemical terms then! Interesting! I was reading about hydrogenation process the other day (didn’t understand half of it unfortunately) and I noticed ‘cis’ fats. I knew about transfats before, but that ‘cis’ made me thinking whether these terms came from chemistry.
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    @ngarayeva001 - It's from organic chemistry and refers to the position of groups around a C=C double bond.

    A pretty good explanation here.
    https://www.khanacademy.org/science/organic-chemistry/alkenes-alkynes/naming-alkenes/v/cis-trans-and-e-z-naming-scheme-for-alkenes

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