Semi-permanent hair Color ( without ammonia or hydrogen peroxide)



I applied for recognized formula which is :


Acid black 107 dissolved in benzyl alcohol 
then added to mixture of isopropyl alchol and tween 80 instead of  ( miranol ! ) plus water .... that's all
i got the texture and dye look but πŸ˜” the color didn’t hold on hair ( didn’t dye the hair ) after washing with water only  the hair became white again !!

do you have an idea ? What is wrong 

i am using acid black 107 ( the same name in formula but from supplier import it for different usage "clothes dyes" ) 

many thanks for helping 😊

Comments

  • baheybahey Member

    This is the formula 
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    What type of hair are you using?

    If the hair is not damaged, it is not going to adhere as well. Try it with bleached damaged hair.
  • If you're using bleached, human hair the bleaching process may have left the cuticle too open and unable to hold the dye. You could test this by trying to dye a piece of your hair sample with a semi permanent dye that is known to be color fast. If it doesn't hold that dye either, you know this issue was caused by over processing the hair
  • Wait, since this is an acid dye won't it need a metal salt?
  • Soexcited said:
    Wait, since this is an acid dye won't it need a metal salt?
    You mean that i need to add salts ?
  • Perry said:
    What type of hair are you using?

    If the hair is not damaged, it is not going to adhere as well. Try it with bleached damaged hair.
    I have tried on bleached hair and normail white hair !
    i gave it to hairdresser to test it on different hair but he told me that the dye doesn’t remain or adhere to hair anymore,
    i am thinking πŸ€” is the dye dissolved well in benzyle alcohol or it need more time or heat to dissolve well and become active !

    thanks Perry
  • baheybahey Member
    Thanks πŸ™ 
  • baheybahey Member
    Any help
  • baheybahey Member
    Really i need your help πŸ˜”
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    Well, I guess the dye you're using doesn't work on hair. I recommend you find different dyes. 

    For example, this product uses 

    HC BLUE NO. 2, BASIC BLUE 99, HC YELLOW NO. 4, BASIC BROWN 16

    I couldn't find any product that uses Black 107
  • GuntherGunther Member
    Perry said:
    Well, I guess the dye you're using doesn't work on hair. I recommend you find different dyes. 

    For example, this product uses 

    HC BLUE NO. 2, BASIC BLUE 99, HC YELLOW NO. 4, BASIC BROWN 16

    I couldn't find any product that uses Black 107
    What opens the hair cuticle in that formulation?
    Urea?

    Blackest Black Semi Permanent Hair Color
    Ingredients
    WATER, UREA, CETEARYL ALCOHOL, PEG-5 COCAMINE, PEG-29 CASTOR OIL, GLYCOL DISTEARATE, CETEARETH-33, HC BLUE NO. 2, ALCOHOL DENAT., BASIC BLUE 99, HC YELLOW NO. 4, QUATERNIUM-80, PROPYLENE GLYCOL, ETHANOLAMINE, FRAGRANCE, BASIC BROWN 16, POLYQUATERNIUM-22, COCAMIDOPROPYL BETAINE, HEXYL CINNAMAL, LINALOOL
  • baheybahey Member
    Perry said:
    Well, I guess the dye you're using doesn't work on hair. I recommend you find different dyes. 

    For example, this product uses 

    HC BLUE NO. 2, BASIC BLUE 99, HC YELLOW NO. 4, BASIC BROWN 16

    I couldn't find any product that uses Black 107
    Thanks perry for your reply
    i will test different dyes , but i have found many hair dye products use acid black 107 

  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    What hair dye products use acid black 107?  I couldn't find any.
  • Bill_TogeBill_Toge Member, Professional Chemist
    acid dyes generally have very poor washfastness on hair, due to the fact hair carries a negative charge, as does the acid dye, leading to electrostatic repulsion; this is why the vast majority of temporary hairs dyes are basic (i.e. cationic) or neutral
    UK based formulation chemist. Strongest subjects: hair styling, hair bleaches, hair dyes (oxidative and non-oxidative) I know some stuff about: EU regulations, emulsions (O/W and W/O), toothpaste, mouthwash, shampoos, other toiletries
  • baheybahey Member
    Bill_Toge said:
    acid dyes generally have very poor washfastness on hair, due to the fact hair carries a negative charge, as does the acid dye, leading to electrostatic repulsion; this is why the vast majority of temporary hairs dyes are basic (i.e. cationic) or neutral
    Thanks πŸ™ Bill ,
    do you suggest using another hair dye ?
  • baheybahey Member
    Perry said:
    What hair dye products use acid black 107?  I couldn't find any.
    In the attached reference as you see Acid black 107 is the dye used
    another product from france πŸ‡«πŸ‡· use the same dye name ,
    so I guessed that it is the dye could be used
  • baheybahey Member
    Still trying......

  • i'm having the same problem, the acid dye fixes on hair but last only like 2 washes, more or less! but I see in the market products using the same acid dyes, without any basic or HC dye, and it lasts a lot of washes, at least 1 month of washing! I just can't understand how they're doing it, and just can't believe no one in this forum know how to fix it, how does it really work...

    ...I think they're really keeping it secret, you know? lol
  • Bill_TogeBill_Toge Member, Professional Chemist
    edited September 9
    @Lily7 or, more likely, they're actually using HC / basic / non-anionic dyes and not declaring them on the label
    UK based formulation chemist. Strongest subjects: hair styling, hair bleaches, hair dyes (oxidative and non-oxidative) I know some stuff about: EU regulations, emulsions (O/W and W/O), toothpaste, mouthwash, shampoos, other toiletries
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    edited September 10
    @bahey:

    Are you based in Europe?  The dyes that can be used in Europe are much more restricted than those that are allowed in the US.

    I haven't worked on one of these projects in a while, but you will get much better results using a Basic Dye ... and, if I recall there aren't many options for basic dyes that are allowed in the EU market.

    The dyes allowed in the EU market perform poorly relative to the performance you get out of the semi-permanent dyes allowed in the US.

    Check out Pylam Dyes ... they have lines of both Basic and Acid dyes that are for semi-permanent applications.  Stick with the Basic dyes.
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    Provides Formulation Development and Lab-Scale Contract Manufacturing Services.  See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com

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