Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating Parabens and Anionic nonionic Surfactants

  • Parabens and Anionic nonionic Surfactants

    Posted by Chirag on January 8, 2019 at 3:53 pm

    Hi all, I would like to thank Perry for first, who created such a useful and knowledge sharing platform and thanks to all whose articles are creating values to me.
    Now my question is
    I am preparing antibacterial hand wash whose composition is -
    Aqua                               46% approx
    SLES .                            40%

    CAPB .                           7-8%
    GLYCERIN .                   5%
    EGMS .                           2%
    Disodium EDTA.          .5%
    METHYL PARABEN .  .5%
    PROPYL PARABEN .   .5%
    PERFUME
    COLOR

    My questions are :

    1) Some formulations include tetraSodium EDTA. Here I m using Disodium EDTA. What should be used out of these two ?

    2) some incorporate salicilyc Acid while other use Triclosan, which should I select in my formulations ?

    3) do Parabens goes well with Anionic SLES and nonionic CAPB,CMEA ?  I m incorporating Parabens In cool down phase. Is this Correct way to incorporate ? 

    4) what should be the optimum pH of the formula so that the preservatives can be effective ?

    Chirag replied 5 years, 2 months ago 8 Members · 16 Replies
  • 16 Replies
  • ngarayeva001

    Member
    January 8, 2019 at 7:49 pm

    1) Tetrasodium EDTA is used for clear products and basic products (above 7). Disodium EDTA is a stronger chelator and used in acidic products. So, if you are formulating a surfactant with pH >7 and you want it to be transparent use Tetrasodium.
    2) not competent in this area.
    3) Parabens are used with various surfactants. 
    4) Germaben II that consists of: Propylparaben, methylparaben, diazolidinyl urea, propylene glycol, has effective pH range of 3-7.5. It’s temperature sensitive and should be added to the cool down phase.

  • chemicalmatt

    Member
    January 8, 2019 at 10:10 pm

    chirag: Na2 EDTA does fine at 0.10% unless you have REALLY hard water. Do not use either SalAc or triclosan, but do use p-chloro-m-xylenol (PCMX) at 0.50%, then you will not only have an anti-bactierial soap but you won’t need another preservative. If using PCMX, optimum pH should be in the range of 8.0 - 8.5. Also, drop the glycerin. Completely. Why formulators continue to place glycerin into surfactant cleansing products is beyond me. All it does is decrease foam, viscosity and body and does nothing else. I guess they think it remoisturizes or something? Not while it is flowing down the shower drain. Remoisturizes sewer cockroaches, then?

  • ngarayeva001

    Member
    January 9, 2019 at 6:45 pm

    I guess they think it remoisturizes or something? Not while it is flowing down the shower drain. Remoisturizes sewer cockroaches, then?

    @chemicalmatt, you persuaded me :D

  • ozgirl

    Member
    January 9, 2019 at 9:07 pm

    @chemicalmatt Glycerin is often used to increase the density of the formulation which can help to keep the pearlescent from settling.

  • belassi

    Member
    January 10, 2019 at 5:25 am

    I did an experiment to see if it is true that glycerin reduces foam in a shampoo. I made identical shampoos, except one contained 3% glycerin. There was no difference in foam profile.

  • amitvedakar

    Member
    January 10, 2019 at 5:29 am
    I think Methyl paraben & Propyl paraben  are at high level.
    sodium salt water soluble. 
  • belassi

    Member
    January 10, 2019 at 5:31 am

    I agree, 1% parabens is far too much and the ratio of methyl:propyl is way off.

  • oldperry

    Member
    January 10, 2019 at 7:00 pm

    Glycerin might help stop the product from becoming crusty in the delivery system if it is delivered from a pump.

  • Chirag

    Member
    January 16, 2019 at 5:03 am

    1) Tetrasodium EDTA is used for clear products and basic products (above 7). Disodium EDTA is a stronger chelator and used in acidic products. So, if you are formulating a surfactant with pH >7 and you want it to be transparent use Tetrasodium.
    2) not competent in this area.
    3) Parabens are used with various surfactants. 
    4) Germaben II that consists of: Propylparaben, methylparaben, diazolidinyl urea, propylene glycol, has effective pH range of 3-7.5. It’s temperature sensitive and should be added to the cool down phase.

    Thanku for answering the questions.
    To my 2nd ques you have said that both the Salisylic Acid and Triclosan are not Compatible in this area. But some Formulations include these including Reckitt benckisers Dettol. If not these than which Antibectarial Agent should II prefer ?

  • Chirag

    Member
    January 16, 2019 at 5:08 am

    chirag: Na2 EDTA does fine at 0.10% unless you have REALLY hard water. Do not use either SalAc or triclosan, but do use p-chloro-m-xylenol (PCMX) at 0.50%, then you will not only have an anti-bactierial soap but you won’t need another preservative. If using PCMX, optimum pH should be in the range of 8.0 - 8.5. Also, drop the glycerin. Completely. Why formulators continue to place glycerin into surfactant cleansing products is beyond me. All it does is decrease foam, viscosity and body and does nothing else. I guess they think it remoisturizes or something? Not while it is flowing down the shower drain. Remoisturizes sewer cockroaches, then?

    Chemicalmatt thanks for Taking time out. If I avoid GLYCERIN then which in ngredient can be used to moisturize our hands. Can we use Polyquates ?

  • Chirag

    Member
    January 16, 2019 at 5:22 am

    Belassi said:

    I did an experiment to see if it is true that glycerin reduces foam in a shampoo. I made identical shampoos, except one contained 3% glycerin. There was no difference in foam profile.

    @Belassi infa t Susan Barclay writes, in her Articles, that GLYCERIN Increases the bubble size.

  • Chirag

    Member
    January 16, 2019 at 5:26 am

    Belassi said:

    I agree, 1% parabens is far too much and the ratio of methyl:propyl is way off.

    @Belassi thank You so much. What should be the correct ratio for methyl to PROPYL PARABEN ?

  • belassi

    Member
    January 16, 2019 at 5:40 am
  • em88

    Member
    January 18, 2019 at 7:34 am

    Methyl Paraben: Propyl Paraben can be used in the ration of 3:1 or 2:1
    0.2% parabens should be enough, still you should verify this with stability tests.

  • Chirag

    Member
    January 28, 2019 at 6:20 pm
  • Chirag

    Member
    January 28, 2019 at 6:21 pm

    em88 said:

    Methyl Paraben: Propyl Paraben can be used in the ration of 3:1 or 2:1
    0.2% parabens should be enough, still you should verify this with stability tests.

    Thank you em88

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