Probiotics in skin care - what is your opinion?
marinam
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Hi, this is my first post here and I am happy to have joined your corner! <span>
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I have developed my own natural skin care in Norway and I have been using probiotic juices in some of the skin care products. I am not an educated chemist, I am self taught and passionate about skin care!
I recently got an email where another brand suggests that my probiotic juice is not any good and that they are actually the only brand in the world who has live, active bacteria in their products, because they use level 4 of probiotics. This was new info for me and I would like to know if you have heard of these levels of probiotics before?
The levels are as such:
Level 1: These products use the “broth” from a microbial soup. The microbes are grown on a substrate (think of this as a watery solution of microbial nutrients) and then the probiotic microbes are filtered off. The “broth” is the remaining solution (which has the products of the microbes in it.)
Level 2: These probiotic extracts are called lysates because the probiotic cells are ruptured – obviously killing them in the process. In this technique, the probiotics are again cultured in a nutrient-rich substrate but instead of filtering them off, the cells are broken so that their cell contents leak out before the mixture is filtered. This method results in an “extract” that contains the cytoplasm (cell contents) of probiotic microbes.
Level 3: In this technique, the microbes are kept whole but they are killed with heat. This process is called tyndallisation and here the culture of probiotics is heated to 60 °C and cooled again over three days. These probiotics can still dock onto skin cells but obviously can’t grow and divide to significantly alter the skin’s microbiome.
Level 4: This is the incorporation of live probiotic microbes in the final product. There are a number of difficulties in this process. Firstly, the use of a preservative system would kill the microbes, so the product needs to be preservative free. Secondly, it is exceedingly difficult to ensure that the probiotics are not killed during the production process. Thirdly, there are storage considerations for the final product … if the temperature drops too low, then the water in the probiotic cells will freeze and, because water expands when it freezes, the cell membrane of these cells will break and most of the cells will die. If the temperature rises above 40 °C, the enzymes in the live cells will start to denature and, again, most of the probiotics will die.
The brand then claims that they have overcomed these challenges and that they are the only brand in the world to have active, live bacteria in their products that can live up to 2 years.
I would love to know your take and opinion about probiotics in skin care. Thank you so much for any comments
</span> I have developed my own natural skin care in Norway and I have been using probiotic juices in some of the skin care products. I am not an educated chemist, I am self taught and passionate about skin care!
I recently got an email where another brand suggests that my probiotic juice is not any good and that they are actually the only brand in the world who has live, active bacteria in their products, because they use level 4 of probiotics. This was new info for me and I would like to know if you have heard of these levels of probiotics before?
The levels are as such:
Level 1: These products use the “broth” from a microbial soup. The microbes are grown on a substrate (think of this as a watery solution of microbial nutrients) and then the probiotic microbes are filtered off. The “broth” is the remaining solution (which has the products of the microbes in it.)
Level 2: These probiotic extracts are called lysates because the probiotic cells are ruptured – obviously killing them in the process. In this technique, the probiotics are again cultured in a nutrient-rich substrate but instead of filtering them off, the cells are broken so that their cell contents leak out before the mixture is filtered. This method results in an “extract” that contains the cytoplasm (cell contents) of probiotic microbes.
Level 3: In this technique, the microbes are kept whole but they are killed with heat. This process is called tyndallisation and here the culture of probiotics is heated to 60 °C and cooled again over three days. These probiotics can still dock onto skin cells but obviously can’t grow and divide to significantly alter the skin’s microbiome.
Level 4: This is the incorporation of live probiotic microbes in the final product. There are a number of difficulties in this process. Firstly, the use of a preservative system would kill the microbes, so the product needs to be preservative free. Secondly, it is exceedingly difficult to ensure that the probiotics are not killed during the production process. Thirdly, there are storage considerations for the final product … if the temperature drops too low, then the water in the probiotic cells will freeze and, because water expands when it freezes, the cell membrane of these cells will break and most of the cells will die. If the temperature rises above 40 °C, the enzymes in the live cells will start to denature and, again, most of the probiotics will die.
The brand then claims that they have overcomed these challenges and that they are the only brand in the world to have active, live bacteria in their products that can live up to 2 years.
I would love to know your take and opinion about probiotics in skin care. Thank you so much for any comments
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If a cosmetic product has the ability to maintain the life of its intentionally included micro-organisms it will also have the ability to similarly maintain the lives of any contaminant organisms. The consequences of that could be catastrophic. Even if your packaged product complies with your requirements of a mono-culture, as soon as it is opened there is a distinct danger, almost a certaintly, of contamination.
Use the search facility (top, right) for more posts on this subject. Use the keyword probiotics
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
even if they did have cultures which were live at the point of manufacture, there are a number of preservatives listed in their formulas, so these cultures would not survive for long
in short, they are either lying or severely mistaken
Simmondsia Chinensis (Jojoba) Seed Oil*, Sesamum Indicum (Sesame) Seed Oil*, Butyrospermum Parkii (Shea) Butter*, Hydrogenated Vegetable Oil, Isoamyl Laurate, Lactobacillus, Tocopherol, Helianthus Annuus (Sunflower) Seed Oil, Ascorbyl Palmitate, Vanillin, Gamma Decalactone
What they are doing is including lyophilized (free dried) Lactobacillus in an anhydrous base. Upon contact with the skin, the lyophilized Lactobacillus reconstitute.
The "trick" in the marketing language is the statement about over 1 billion "live" bacteria ... technically, that is correct as the Lactobacillus will reconstitute upon contact with water.
@Bill_Toge: Lyophilized cell culture are not dead ... more like in suspended state ... once they come in contact with water, the bacteria will repopulate.
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
In my own forumula I use fermented broccoli sprouts and also tomato, aloe vera, green tea etc. The process is that these ingredients is made into a juice (we use the whole fruit, also seeds and stilk and root if possible) and then mix this into a live probiotic bacteria ''soup''. this is stored on tanks that are temperature controlled. After 30 days this mix is used in the final product. Do you think that our bacteria in our mix survive or reconstitute when in contact with the skin? Is there a way to test this? I would like to have as good products as possible and also to be able to say that our probiotic juices are alive.
I'll caution you that the only "safe" technique to incorporate bacteria into cosmetic products is to use lyophilized bacteria in an anhydrous matrix. Anything other than that and you're courting trouble. There is no reason to take that risk.
To answer your question: Any bacteria, when lyophilized, will reconstitute when it is rehydrated with water.
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
Extreme risk of something horrible (and costly in legal fees) resulting from this exercise.
I strongly suggest that you give up with this and work on something more conventional and safer.
The potential for truly catastrophic levels of damage is immense. Moreover, if someone gets harmed by your product, the potential legal disaster could spill over onto everyone who works for you, who does business with you, and even onto anyone who's ever even given you advice.
You could lose your business. In some places, you could even be convicted and sent to jail, as could your employees.
The only thing worse than what you're doing would be to deliberately include deadly levels of poison into your products. I just don't have the words to tell you how bad this is. Are you taking any precautions at all to make sure that you're not introducing lethal levels of pathogens into your products?
This company has an excellent marketing division turning something quite ordinary into something quite magical.
This alone should discourage you from attempting this project.
"I am not an educated Veterinarian, I am self taught and passionate about animals", yet my neighbors get angry if I try to spay or neuter their pets.
To be honest, I really do not get why you are so worried about probiotic juices that are developed to be used in skin care? And yes, I do make sure that the end product is safe to use.
1. Living bacteria in cosmetic products (good or bad) are forbidden in EU.
2. Tyndallisation is performed at 121 °C for 15 minutes (see wiki) and still not reliable
3. Just add level 5 - make sure everything is dead - and your juice might be successful!
As far as I understand the big problem is the bactericidal action of surfactants. Sodium lauryl and laureth sulphate kill the bacteria. Unless you have a solution, you need a surfactant to suspend the bacteria. And you need a lot of it. I have read that glycereth is milder, i guess you should just use the glycereth and be fine. The Chrisal is extremely thick but almost not oily - I would guess 10 to 15 weight % of surfactant and ten times less of bacteria.
Bacteria is probably better than the typical vaginal soap - Lactacyd ( as the name says) is based on lactic acid. Imagine the lactic acid bacillus in Lactacyd. Just use enough lactic acid to have the right pH needed for vaginal care (acidic, but not too much) and let the bacteria produce it on the spot.
Does Lactacyd have any preservatives? I guess it is designed to kill the "bad" bacteria but it should not interfere with the "good" bacteria?
https://shop.motherdirt.com/shop/
http://www.codecheck.info/kosmetik_koerperpflege/koerperpflege/intimpflege_reinigung/id_385769/Lactacyd_femina_plus.pro
Reading further into the Wiki entry you will find the correct procedure for Tyndallisation:
Does this mean that because the bacteria survive in Chrisal soap because there is no preservative? If I compare the ingredients of Lactacyd and Chrisal, if one gets rid of preservatives one could just add the yogurt bacteria?
This probiotic / prebiotic stuff realy interests me. It is a step further from just making an emulsion? Imagine the Chrisal variant for intimal care
The ingredient in Crisal Soap is Lactobacillus Ferment, not live bacteria ... it is the components of the bacterial cell wall that have been sonicated to release the contents and then, most likely, any remaining solids are filtered off.
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
For a layperson's opinion, if I saw "live probiotics" or "active probiotics" touted in skincare, I would immediately think the product is suspect. If someone I cared about was using such a product, I'd research it for safety and come away advising against it. Another thing to consider is that every person's skin has a slightly different optimal set point of natural skin microbes. I wouldn't know how a "live probiotic" product might disrupt or enhance the skin barrier for any one particular person.
Ingredients:
Proprietary organic probiotic blend in an enzyme enriched substrate: Lactobacillus Acidophilus, L.Rhamnosus, L.Salivarius, L.Casei, L.Plantarum, Lactococcus Lactis, Streptococcus Thermophilus, Bifidobacteruim Bifidum, B.Lactis, B.Infantis, B.Breve, B.Longum; Made from water and a propretary blend of three organic grasses.
Here's the problem I have with product such as this. Note the sleight of hand in the language ... essentially claiming that their product is "ideal" for a variety of medical conditions "according to our customers", but then stating that the statements have not been evaluated by the FDA and that the product is not intended to treat, cure or prevent any diseases.
Our 12 strains of symbiotic probiotics spray can help the skin stay balnced, calmer and more resisitance to aging. *
According to our customers, this is ideal for people who suffer from rosacea, rashes, scrapes, cuts, staph-type infections, nose, eye or ear infections, athlete's foot, jock itch, ringworm, and yeast infections.
LiviaOne Topical Probiotics can benefit as:
* These statements has not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any diseases.
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
Marketing aside, do you suppose these are actually dead or are they taking a legal risk?
Note that the bacteria in this product are primarily found in the human gut, not on the skin. So, if you wanted a product that would be effective on the skin, why would you use gut probiotic bacteria instead of skin microbiome bacteria? The skin and gut are completely different environments.
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
If you follow recent FDA actions, this is an incorrect statement. The FDA has been following up on numerous lines which make false claims for their Cosmetic products. On one hand, the FDA does not have the staff to follow up on every line, but with the increased usage of online sales, the FDA does have to ability to identify and censure the offenders. It has been increasing of late.