Konjac gum skin feel in emulsion

After reading some discussions in forum i saw people like konjac gum. I haven't used it so my questions are


1. How do you compare skin feel of an emulsion with konjac gum compared to emulsion with following?
A. Xanthan gum
B. Acacia gum
C. Guar gum
D. HEC
E. HPMC
F. Gellan gum

Comments

  • MaydayMayday Member
    edited December 2021
    I wonder if @LisaLise could help? I've been curious about konjac glucomannan since I read her blog posts on it being nearly equivalent to carbomer.

    * https://www.lisaliseblog.com/2012/05/konjac-glucomannan-vs-carbomer-whos.html
    * https://www.lisaliseblog.com/2012/04/konjac-glucomannan-plant-based-answer.html

    Also that it a synergizes with xanthan gum to massively increase viscosity with such small amounts, and I wonder if that combination may avoid the pilling effect while keeping the texture pleasant.

    * https://skinchakra.eu/blog/archives/443-What-you-need-to-know-about-natural-gums-part-II-Gum-blending.html
    ⚠️ I have a lot of ideas, but not much experience! Please keep this in mind when reading my suggestions. ⚠️
  • Mayday said:
    I wonder if @LisaLise could help? I've been curious about konjac glucomannan since I read her blog posts on it being nearly equivalent to carbomer.

    * https://www.lisaliseblog.com/2012/05/konjac-glucomannan-vs-carbomer-whos.html
    * https://www.lisaliseblog.com/2012/04/konjac-glucomannan-plant-based-answer.html

    Also that it a synergizes with xanthan gum to massively increase viscosity with such small amounts, and I wonder if that combination may avoid the pilling effect while keeping the texture pleasant.

    * https://skinchakra.eu/blog/archives/443-What-you-need-to-know-about-natural-gums-part-II-Gum-blending.html
    Thanks 
    Very informative
  • Also if anybody knows where to get konjac glucomannan as someone who only has access to repackers/online, it'd be appreciated! I've found Now Foods Glucomannan (supplement) and Modernist Pantry Konjac Gum, but am hesitant to order them because I am doubtful they are suitable for making clear gels...
    ⚠️ I have a lot of ideas, but not much experience! Please keep this in mind when reading my suggestions. ⚠️
  • justaerinjustaerin Member
    edited December 2021
    Mayday said:
    Also if anybody knows where to get konjac glucomannan as someone who only has access to repackers/online, it'd be appreciated! I've found Now Foods Glucomannan (supplement) and Modernist Pantry Konjac Gum, but am hesitant to order them because I am doubtful they are suitable for making clear gels...

    I don't know where to get cosmetic specific glucomannan, but I've got an old container of the Now Glucomannan (bought 2015 with best by date of Feb 2018) so I did a quick test with 0.5 g in 100 g water. A bit of shear mixing and 25 seconds in the microwave and more mixing... and as I remembered, once the air bubbles mostly disappear it is a clear but slightly hazy gel. I might be processing it wrong and it was a very lazy test, but I think it would probably be closer to carbomer clear at lower concentration.
    Unfortunately, it still has a noticable fishy smell at 0.5%. The downside of glucomannan/konjac is the smell, very like BTMS but more tenacious. Maybe since the last time I bought it processing has gotten to the point of removing the fishy smell from the konjac sold as food grade, or maybe I'm just unusually sensitive to it.
    Now might be using a different supplier by now, so it isn't a terribly fair test. Modernist Pantry might be using a clearer or less smelly grade than Now, but I haven't tried it.
  • justaerin said:
    Unfortunately, it still has a noticable fishy smell at 0.5%. The downside of glucomannan/konjac is the smell, very like BTMS but more tenacious. Maybe since the last time I bought it processing has gotten to the point of removing the fishy smell from the konjac sold as food grade, or maybe I'm just unusually sensitive to it.
    Now might be using a different supplier by now, so it isn't a terribly fair test. Modernist Pantry might be using a clearer or less smelly grade than Now, but I haven't tried it.

    When I contacted Modernist Pantry, they said that their Xanthan and Konjac produce a transparent solution at 0.5% (though I have not verified it). I think Konjac has a tendency to be somewhat fishy, as I recall some people complaining on reddit about zero-carb shirataki noodles being fishy... but for all I know they were making noodles with the Now foods glucomannan. However, it's possible that Modernist Pantry has a more clarified grade. I'll try out theirs once I get the chance.

    ⚠️ I have a lot of ideas, but not much experience! Please keep this in mind when reading my suggestions. ⚠️
  • MicroformulationMicroformulation Member, Professional Chemist
    markfuller@microformulation.com Microformulation.com Microformulation Cosmetic Consulting provides Custom Formulations for both large Commercial accounts as well as smaller entrepreneurs. We can provide Naturally compliant Formulations under the NSF, NPA, Whole Foods and USDA Organic Certifications. BS.Pharm Albany College of Pharmacy, Union University.
  • MicroformulationMicroformulation Member, Professional Chemist
    edited December 2021
    markfuller@microformulation.com Microformulation.com Microformulation Cosmetic Consulting provides Custom Formulations for both large Commercial accounts as well as smaller entrepreneurs. We can provide Naturally compliant Formulations under the NSF, NPA, Whole Foods and USDA Organic Certifications. BS.Pharm Albany College of Pharmacy, Union University.
  • justaerinjustaerin Member
    edited December 2021
    Mayday said:
    justaerin said:
    Unfortunately, it still has a noticable fishy smell at 0.5%. The downside of glucomannan/konjac is the smell, very like BTMS but more tenacious. Maybe since the last time I bought it processing has gotten to the point of removing the fishy smell from the konjac sold as food grade, or maybe I'm just unusually sensitive to it.
    Now might be using a different supplier by now, so it isn't a terribly fair test. Modernist Pantry might be using a clearer or less smelly grade than Now, but I haven't tried it.

    When I contacted Modernist Pantry, they said that their Xanthan and Konjac produce a transparent solution at 0.5% (though I have not verified it). I think Konjac has a tendency to be somewhat fishy, as I recall some people complaining on reddit about zero-carb shirataki noodles being fishy... but for all I know they were making noodles with the Now foods glucomannan. However, it's possible that Modernist Pantry has a more clarified grade. I'll try out theirs once I get the chance.


    Konjac in all pre-made noodle and powder forms that I've encountered has had that smell, but I have only used it in versions or grades sold for food. If I was trying out konjac for cosmetics, I'd start with what I've already got, but I only make stuff for myself so it is low risk and saves money. It is enough more elegant in texture than xanthan gum that I keep it around for cooking, though I obviously don't use much of it. The smell isn't a problem in sauce, but it was noticable in plain water. The smell of the noodles is strong.
    The things I've bought from Modernist Pantry have typically been a little nicer than the same ingredients from other sellers of food-use items. Now isn't bad, but they're selling to supplement seekers, not molecular gastronomy enthusiasts. Cosmetic suppliers might have special cosmetic grades that don't smell as much or are clearer, but I don't know of any repackers that sell glucomannan.

  • @Microformulation thanks for those links!
    ⚠️ I have a lot of ideas, but not much experience! Please keep this in mind when reading my suggestions. ⚠️
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