Hair gel soaping

edited April 2017 in Formulating
I have formulated a hair gel based on 5% Aculyn 88 & Acudyne 1000 at around 2.25% level. The remaining ingredients are 5% monopropylene glycol, preservative and a neutralizer either AMP-95 or TEA 99%. The pH is around 7.8 and the properties can be modified using PVP K90. The only problem I am facing is soaping while rubbing the product between the palms, have tried using a little silicone anti-foam but it makes the product slightly hazy. Is there anything else I could do to eliminate soaping or something important I am missing here?
Appreciate any input or pointer if any. 

Comments

  • A few % of ethanol may help with the soaping - and give a slightly faster drying product.
  • @johnb I wish that avenue was open to me, the product is intended for market where ethanol (even denatured) would be a big no in the LOI. 
  • Have you tried lowering ph to 6.0--6.5 ?
  • Isopropanol?
    Robert Zonis, Sr. Formulation Chemist, Beaumont Products "All opinions and comments expressed are my own, have no relation to Beaumont Products, are fully copyrighted, and may not be used without written permission."
  • I have tried lowering the pH but with this polymer system the pH is adjusted between 7.5-8.0 for clarity or else haze persists. 
    Yeah I have tried IPA but seems need to go higher to improve it, will update soon. 
  • Polymer you are using is likely made via emulsion polymerization so residual SAA is cause of foaming.Try adding EO/PO block copolymer such as Pluronic L 31 but use at very low level ie 0.5 as it will also decrease viscosity.Add to polymer emulsion before neutralization.
  • Thank you for your observation, will definitely give it a try though I have had success with Anti foam emulsion at a very low level. 
    Just a thing though, what do you refer to when you mention SAA? Acrylic acid? 
  • Just out of curiosity, why is the slight haze from the antifoam a problem?
    Robert Zonis, Sr. Formulation Chemist, Beaumont Products "All opinions and comments expressed are my own, have no relation to Beaumont Products, are fully copyrighted, and may not be used without written permission."
  • @chemist 77--SAA is surface active agent used in EP.
  • No problem @Bobzchemist, just how the customer requested. But I have explained him exactly what you are trying to imply here that the performance would largely be unaffected.
    Thanks @DRBOB@VERDIENT.BIZ, went a bit over the top that abbreviated term for me. 
  • edited September 11
    hello i made a reaserch and i found that from most effective defoamer is ethanol but the question what is lowest level can be used for ethanol to act as a good defoamer?
    i will work for it, but i will be happy if anyone have answer for my question.
  • Ethanol is hardly the most effective and you would need a high amount to notice a decent result. Regular AFs are used at 50-200ppm.

    A little late, but on topic: @Chemist77 I take you were using a silicone based emulsion. I talked to dow corning people a few months ago and there aren't any good news, turbidity comes with the package and there's no significant improvement or breakthrough ahead =(

    For transparency try glycolic based antifoam. The cons are x2 price and x2 dosage.
  • @DAS thanks for that information but still reasearching for lowest ethanol dose to be defoamer.
  • That will depend on the surfactant.
  • edited September 12
    @Das for sure you have right for my case it is about 28% of no ionique surfactant ceatereth 25 .
  • Forget it, ethanol won't work. Use a regular one.
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